Ask Blair to meet Dalai Lama in UK, spring 2004

[nelly]

To all - there is a campaign here in the UK to try and encourage Blair to meet up with the Dalai Lama in his upcoming visit to the UK. Please help out, especially UK residents, many thanks .........



Call on Blair to meet with Dalai Lama in UK, May/June 2004
Urgent Campaign - 12 February 2004

(Please contact Free Tibet Campaign if acting after 28 May 2004)


The Dalai Lama is visiting the UK between 28 May and 3 June 2004. However, Downing Street has already let it be known that the Prime Minister will be unable to meet the Dalai Lama because of "diary pressures". Free Tibet Campaign believes that the Prime Minister should make time in his diary for the Noble Laureate as it would send a powerful message to the Chinese Government in advance of the Dalai Lama's visit and a proposed visit by the Chinese Premier to the UK which will take place in a similar time period. Indeed, Blair has indicated his willingness to create space in his diary for important or symbolic events in the past, as was demonstrated by his last-minute reception of the winning English rugby team!

The Dalai Lama's visit to the UK comes at a crucial time as momentum created by re-opening formal contact between the Chinese Government and the exiled Tibetan Government (begun in September 2002) seems to be slowing down. International support is needed to bolster this effort and by meeting the Dalai Lama, Blair would demonstrate that the world requires results from China. The UK could play a key role in providing international support for this process given our historic connection to Tibet, illustrated by the fact that 2004 is the centenary year of the British invasion of Tibet led by Francis Younghusband!

The Dalai Lama last visited London in 1999 when he met with the Prime Minister and Richard Llewllin, Bishop at Lambeth in what was described as a "spiritual meeting", rather than a political one in order not to offend Chinese Government sensitivities. The USA has engaged in no such smoke-screen, as at least two Presidents have met with the Dalai Lama regularly ( George W Bush and Clinton). Moreover, it is important for the UK to take a strong public stand on the need for a negotiated settlement during the Dalai Lama's visit, particularly as Chinese Prime Minister ,Wen Jiabao is expected to visit London in May or June. China will be paying very close attention to how the UK handles the Dalai Lama's visit. A strong UK position on Tibet, both publicly and behind the scenes, would be most helpful in encouraging real progress. ( There will be an urgent campaign on the Chinese Premier's visit as soon as the dates of his are confirmed).

Action

1. Write directly to Tony Blair MP urging him to make time in his diary to meet with the Dalai Lama or to issue a public statement of concern about Tibet. Point out that the Noble Peace Laureate, who received his reward 15 years ago, is an important figure in helping to reach a peaceful negotiated settlement to Tibet. Furthermore, state that a meeting with Blair would act as an incentive to the Chinese Government to continue the process, particularly with a scheduled visit by the Chinese Premier in a similar time period. Highlight the fact that it is the centenary year of the British invasion of Tibet and that it thus incumbent upon the UK to act with honour in regard to Tibet.

2. Write to your MP and urge them to sign EDM 437 (calls on the Prime Minister to make time in his diary to meet the Dalai Lama), or to make a public statement on Tibet. You can use www.faxyourmp.com to contact your MP via the internet or write via the House of Commons (see below)

Also ask your MP to write directly to Mr Blair urging him to meet with the Dalai Lama or to make a public statement on Tibet.

1. Rt Hon Tony Blair MP
10 Downing St
London SW1A 1AA
Salutation: Dear Prime Minister

2. Write to your MP
c/o House of Commons
London SW1A 0AA


Please send copies of any responses you receive to Free Tibet Campaign, as this helps us to monitor the situation.

If you have an email address and would like to receive urgent campaigns by email, please email us at paul@freetibet.org with SUBSCRIBE URGENT CAMPAIGN LIST in the subject or body of message. Please include your name and address.

If you would like to make a donation towards the Urgent Campaign Scheme please go to www.freetibet.org/membership/join.html and click on Online Secure Payment. Under the Donation section please select Urgent Campaign Scheme. Alternative payment methods are explained on the same page. Thank you.

Free Tibet Campaign also has an Action Email List, which sends out details of upcoming Free Tibet Campaign activities as well as a monthly Tibet-related events diary (UK events only). To subscribe to this list please send a message to paul@freetibet.org with SUBSCRIBE ACTION LIST in the subject or body of message. Please include your name and address.



http://www.freetibet.org/campaigns/hhdluk120204.html

[hummalumma]

Commendable Nelly. Tony Blair is a puppet, so he needs to be
told that it is ok to meet with him by the right person. So perhaps it is a matter of time.


It is rather sad that our Prime Minister Paul Martin also refuses
to meet with HHDL.

Whereas in Russia, HHDL can not event get a VISA!
The world's most benign leader being treated unfairly makes me
feel sad. They accept the PRC into their respective countries, yet
a spiritual leader of peace is denied. What a twisted world we
live in.

[yugaung]

Originally posted by nelly
\Highlight the fact that it is the centenary year of the British invasion of Tibet and that it thus incumbent upon the UK to act with honour in regard to Tibet.

Colonel Younghusband led an invasion of Tibet in 1904.
Their pretext was Tibet was comming under Russian influence.
They invaded Tibet, killed 1700 Tibetans and found no Russians.
(This reminded me of Iraq's "weapon of mass distruction".)
Britain then asked China's central Gov to pay war indemity.
After China paid the war indemity (more like ransom money) the invaders pulled out.

Today UK gov is still funding all kinds of separatist activities in China. The London based Tibet Information Network get a yearly grant from the British Gov. The Voice of Tibet is funded by both US and British Gov.
Blair do not want to too openly support separatist activities posibily because of N Ireland.

[nelly]

Your posts are not coming across well, whats your problem with Tibet and people trying to help them retain their land, culture and traditions?
You mention the native American devastation in another post - if you can appreciate that tragedy, surely you are sympathetic to the similar destruction of the Tibetan people?
Nelly

[yugaung]

Originally posted by nelly
Your posts are not coming across well, whats your problem with Tibet and people trying to help them retain their land, culture and traditions?
You mention the native American devastation in another post - if you can appreciate that tragedy, surely you are sympathetic to the similar destruction of the Tibetan people?
Nelly

I am not writing to please anybody.
Just stating the truth.
Tibet is a much better place than it was under the rule of the cleric class.
The current propaganda campaign is conducted by the CIA with the help of the British Gov. They are always togerther!

I have studied their propaganda for years.
One common practice is for them to graft their own sins on to the Chinese.

Americans, for example, have for years forced sterilized their native women, so, their propagandist grafted the same crime on to the Chinese.
Naturally this type of allegation repeated 1000s of time arouse a lot of emotion.
Recently a team of American anthropologist led by Prof. Mel Goldstein, director of the Centre of Research on Tibet, at Case Western Reserve University found no evidence of such practice.

TIBET: Mother & Child[\B]
http://www.tibet.ca/wtnarchive/2001/12/23_1.html
A new study disputes charges by Tibetan activists of forced abortions and sterilizations by authorities

US and UK have the most sophisticated brainwashing mechinery in the world. They are so well disguised that you don't realized it.
They don't harm the interest of the mainstream white population so there is little outcry for change. That may explain why I am not very popular here, a risk I have to take.
-------

[B]Forced sterilization of native women in USA
http://www.isis.csuhayward.edu/ALSS/soc/NAN/dd/6800sj/slj.htm
In the mid-1970s a Choctaw-Tsalagi Indian Health Services
doctor was approached by a 26-year-old American Indian woman who desired a "womb transplant." She had been
sterilized
when she was 20 at the Indian Health Service hospital in Claremont, Oklahoma. It was discoverd that 75 percent of
the
Claremont sterilizations were non-therapeutic, that women American Indians were being prompted to sign
sterilization forms they didn't understand, that they were being told the operations were reversible, and that some
women were even being asked to sign sterilization papers while they had yet to come out of birthing sedation.

Common Sense magazine reported that the Indian Health Service "was sterilizing 3,000 Indian women per year, 4 to
6 percent of the child bearing population...Dr. R. T. Ravenholt, [then] director of the federal government's Office of
Population, later confirmed that 'surgical sterilization has become increasingly important in recent years as one of
the advanced methods of fertility management'."

[nelly]

yugaung, I just don't know where to start, you are clearly quite firm in your anger against the UK and US. As a UK citizen I am deeply ashamed by the actions of the British state both current and past, perpetrated against many countries and people all over the world. But to suspect everything related to Free Tibet movement as some kind of UK and CIA conspiracy is ludicrous in my opinion. Has it ever occured to you why the movement exists in the first place? There is cultural genocide in Tibet, there is and horrendous religious persecution, there has been many deaths and suffering over the years of occupation, I am staggered to the core of my being that the world has watched all this happen. There are huge numbers of refugees living in absolute squalor in places like India and Nepal. This is why I support the free Tibet movement, not because I have been brainwashed by the CIA. I know propaganda when I see it and am living through it constantly with the whole War on Terror debacle and the Israeli occupation. What you posted from Frontline is clearly propaganda, I found it deeply disturbing.
I'm curious, what is your position on Burma and on North Korea?
We must always remember not to confuse genuine human suffering at the hands of the state and the abuse of that suffering by other states in their foreign policy. It is very hard but we have to separate them, not let the foreign states hijack the issues ( like we have just seen in Iraq ).

[yugaung]

Originally posted by nelly
yugaung, I just don't know where to start, you are clearly quite firm in your anger against the UK and US. As a UK citizen I am deeply ashamed by the actions of the British state both current and past, perpetrated against many countries and people all over the world. But to suspect everything related to Free Tibet movement as some kind of UK and CIA conspiracy is ludicrous in my opinion. Has it ever occured to you why the movement exists in the first place? There is cultural genocide in Tibet, there is and horrendous religious persecution, there has been many deaths and suffering over the years of occupation, I am staggered to the core of my being that the world has watched all this happen. There are huge numbers of refugees living in absolute squalor in places like India and Nepal. This is why I support the free Tibet movement, not because I have been brainwashed by the CIA. I know propaganda when I see it and am living through it constantly with the whole War on Terror debacle and the Israeli occupation. What you posted from Frontline is clearly propaganda, I found it deeply disturbing.
I'm curious, what is your position on Burma and on North Korea?
We must always remember not to confuse genuine human suffering at the hands of the state and the abuse of that suffering by other states in their foreign policy. It is very hard but we have to separate them, not let the foreign states hijack the issues ( like we have just seen in Iraq ).

According to statistics from the Dalai Lama's own Gov in Exile, Tibetans in India have average per capita GDP of US$1800. That's 4.5X that of and average Indian citizen(about US$400).
Generally people in India considers these "refugees" better off than the average Indian and there were many incidence of violent conflict which the western press ignored.

How do you think these super-refugees manage to produce such an economic miracle in the middle of a poor continent?
US and UK are are investing money to use the Tibetans for propaganda and possible canon fodder role in the future.

Can you explain why 100,000 Bhutanese refugees currently living in Nepal receive almost zero attention in the west.
Wasn't Nepal equally close to the hearts of the British people?
As for N Korea and Burmur, these are very bad places.
If you think China is like them you know nothing about Asia.

There are 3 main sources of Tibet Propaganda.
*International Campaign for Tibet
*Tibet Information Network
*Tibetan Center for Human Rights and Democracy
All three are funded by the UK and US gov.
They just dream up a story every 2-3 weeks.

US especially has a big budget for China propaganda especially in inciting Tibetans.
Radio Free Asia is planning a round the clock broadcast to Tibet.
Currently they have 8 hours a day.

They have about 2 hours a day for 60mil viet Namese and 2 hours a day for that horrible place called Burmur.

Doesn't that tell you something?

[hummalumma]

Ever heard of tourism in Dharamsala?

You know I could debate with you and negate your idiocies but it's like being in a stinky bathroom. I just can't stand to hear you out while you let one rip, one after another. Go take a crap somewhere else, Mr.Han Chinese.

WE NEED SOME LYSOL OVA HEEYAH!!

[nelly]

"Can you explain why 100,000 Bhutanese refugees currently living in Nepal receive almost zero attention in the west."

I can assure that this gets attention here as well. To behonest with you, I rarely hear about the situation in Tibet at all on the mainstream news here. Remember recently, there were protests here in London when the Chinese authorities came to visit, these were unlawfully suppressed by the British police, they used tactics that were completely against the law.

I think you are too embedded in some kind of propaganda against the Tibetans, and you are clearly not going to change your mind. I sincerely hope you will. I have friends who have visited Tibet, India and Nepal, and from their first hand knowledge I've heard enough to convince me of the seriousness of the problems.
best wishes
nelly

[yugaung]

Originally posted by nelly
"Can you explain why 100,000 Bhutanese refugees currently living in Nepal receive almost zero attention in the west."

I can assure that this gets attention here as well. To behonest with you, I rarely hear about the situation in Tibet at all on the mainstream news here. Remember recently, there were protests here in London when the Chinese authorities came to visit, these were unlawfully suppressed by the British police, they used tactics that were completely against the law.

I think you are too embedded in some kind of propaganda against the Tibetans, and you are clearly not going to change your mind. I sincerely hope you will. I have friends who have visited Tibet, India and Nepal, and from their first hand knowledge I've heard enough to convince me of the seriousness of the problems.
best wishes
nelly

That's the usual reply I get, "brianwashed ignorant Chinese". Just think about it.
The 100,000 Bhutanese refugees in Nepal don't even get 0.1% of the attention that the Dalai Lama and his supporters get and where else on this earth you find "refugees" live better than their hosts. I don't think anybody dispute the fact that Tibetans in India live far better than average Indian.

The Palestanian organizations are headed by the Palestanians.
Chychen organizations are headed by Chechen.
Why is it that all these free Tibet organizations overwhelmingly dominated and run by Europeans and Euro-Americans?

They only have very few Tibetans as decoration. The brian in these organizations are invariably Europeans.

Take for example the Free Tibet Campaign, London; all that we see is this woman call Alison Renolds running around claiming to speak for Tibet independence. I saw some Tibetans names on the website but you go through their activities or e mails then you get the impression that the Tibetans are just sleeping partners.

[hummalumma]

I think that you are a "brianwashed ignorant Chinese" dude.


...thing is, I have no idea what 'brianwashed' means, so I suggest you go back to your superiors and ask them to provide dictionaries for the next term. But I do know what ignorant means. :D

BTW, why don't admit that you have an agenda and that you idolize Mao-Tse Tung like Mike Tyson? Do you have a tattoo like him too?

Out of curiosity, would you invite the Dalai Lama into your home and cook him dinner?

[yasgursfarmhand]

It is a complex situation and British involvement in Tibetan politics for the last century has been a disaster. I respect the different points of view and state the below in the interests of open debate.

However if Tony Blair won't meet the Dalai Lama, he might still want to question China's repression of Catholics (TB attends Catholic mass everey Sunday with his wife and family, who are Catholics), as well as Buddhists. He might also ask him to allow the Red Cross access to the real Panchen Lama.

I have met the DL twice, the first time when I was 10 and was inspired by his commitment to peace as a form of protest. I believe he deserves our governments respect regardless of upsetting an undemocratically composed government

[yugaung]

Panchen Lama

The history of Tibet is not as romantic as many westerners believe. There were plenty of fight over power.There were assassinations coups and countercoups.
Tibet donot equal the Dalai Lama.
The Dalai Lama shared power with the Panchen Lama and the Royal Comissioners from the central Gov.
Half of the time the Dalai Lamas were children and only played a symbolic role.

Most of the time in history the Panchen Lama and the Dalai Lama were in opposite camps. This was deliberate arrangement when Emperor China, Kangxi made Panchen Erdeni equal in status with that of the Dalai Lama. This was done in order to balance the power of the Dalai Lama.

Back to modern time, the late 10th Panchen Lama was most of his life at odd with the current 14th Dalai Lama. Before his death he already made known to all his followers that he want the next incarnate to be chosen by the golden urn. (Drawing logs)

Upon the death of the 10th Panchen Lama in 1989 the Dalai Lama deliberately picked a boy who was born before the Death of his bitter rival, the 10th Panchen Lama.
He hope to use that dispute to portray himself as a victim of persecution when in fact he is cleverly playing politics, while the Gov followed the will of the late Panchen Lama by choosing a new Panchen Lama by the method of the Golden Urn.

The boy you call the real Panchen Lama was born before the the death of the last (10th) Panchen Lama.

The Gov of China has nothing to gain in picking whichever boy.
Nobody knows their political inclination.
The Gov just want to follow the old tradition of selecting the Panchen Lama by the Golden Urn.

BTW, do you know that the identity of the late 10th Panchen Lama was also disputed by the current Dalai Lama?
There was another 10th Panchen Lama now living somewhere in Scotland.
They are always at odd with one another.

[yasgursfarmhand]

Thanks for your reply and i am aware that this is disagreement as to the validity of the accession of all Panchen Lamas in history.


However that does not explain why the Chinese government will not let anyone visit, or even see Gedhun Choekyi Nyima and his family, let alone those involved in his identification.

Kidnapping children and their families is a crime in all civilised societies.

Why should the PRC interfere in the identification of a religious leader in Tibet? Why is their choice being educated in Beijing?

The oppression of people because of their religious beliefs is contrary to the most basic of human rights in International Law.


I believe Tony Blair should raise these issues with the PRC at every available opportunity.

[yugaung]

Originally posted by yasgursfarmhand
Thanks for your reply and i am aware that this is disagreement as to the validity of the accession of all Panchen Lamas in history.


However that does not explain why the Chinese government will not let anyone visit, or even see Gedhun Choekyi Nyima and his family, let alone those involved in his identification.

Kidnapping children and their families is a crime in all civilised societies.

Why should the PRC interfere in the identification of a religious leader in Tibet? Why is their choice being educated in Beijing?

The oppression of people because of their religious beliefs is contrary to the most basic of human rights in International Law.


I believe Tony Blair should raise these issues with the PRC at every available opportunity.

The central gov of China has always played a role in picking the Dalai Lama and the Panchen Lama. This tradition went back 200 years.
Why?
There has been endless disputes in history on who re-incarnate into who.
Sure you can understand this.

In 1793 Emperor Qianlong decreed that future Dalai Lama and Panchen Lama, when disputed, be picked by the golden urn. (Drawing logs)
The emperor gave a golden urn to the Jokhang Monastery of Lhasa in 1793 for use in identifying boys with the reincarnated souls of the Dalai Lama or the Panchen Erdeni.
See this 200 years old golden urn:
http://www.china.org.cn/ch-xizang/tibet/serie_book/chinese/tibet_buddhism/b21.jpg

The Karmapa was not picked by the golden urn and now we have at least 3 Karmapas, each with big followings and frequently clash violently.

There were times when people tried to bend the rule for political reasons.
There were at least 2 10th Panchen Lama. The current 14th Dalai Lama initially favor the one in Scotland but the central gov insisted on recognizing the one picked by the golden urn. In the end the Dalai Lama gave in and recognized the 10th Panchen Lama picked by the goden urn. Now after his death the same controversy started all over again. Beijing insisted on the one picked by the golden urn. The central gov has a consistent policy.

Recently there was a case custrody dispute.
A 7 years old boy born to a Taiwanese father and a Brazilian mother.
Both parents died in an accident.
The mother's family and the father's family both wanted the child.
The case was brought to court.
The child was exposed to the media everyday.
There were endless interviews from media in Taiwan and Brazil.
All kinds of questions were thrown at this 7 year child.
Finally a judge in Brazil ordered a ban on any further media exposure of this kid.
It's harmful for a 7 year old kid to be exposed to the media constantly.

The Panchen Lama dispute is being exploited for propaganda purposes.
Western media is hunger for news that they can bash China with.
The Chinese gov has nothing to gain kidnapping a child, but has a responsibility to see that he stay out of political controversy.
There is also a concern for his safty.
When he grows up he can choose to migrate to USA and sell his story. There is a big market for this kind of thing.
Why the hurry?
Many Tibetans who claimed to be victims of persecution are allowed to migrate to USA. This can be arranged.

[hummalumma]

Wow!

What a well thought out analogy Mr.HAN CHINESE PRC!

The PRC kidnapped the 11th Panchen Lama and his family for publicity huh? That's why they wouldn't admit it till years later.
And they claimed to have their own...who eventually ran away...haha!

Why do you confirm you snapperheadedness over and over?




Please explain the Tianamen massacre now.



n.b. The Dalai Lama recognized then 6 year old Gendun Choekyi Nyima as the 11th Panchen Lama on May 14th, 1995. On May 17th, he was kidnapped by the PRC and taken to Beijing.

In Dec.1995, the PRC illegaly announced it's own Panchem Lama, Gyaltsen Norbu. Only the Dalai Lama can choose the Panchen Lama. He ran away from the PRC... to Dharamsala. :)

[tenjay]

humma, what would you like to know about the tiananmen massacre? i can probably tell you a little about it from some books i have. i don't think anybody would say it was fair or just.
i also couldn't say that the prc/communist party has had a clean record in dealing with tibet or many other things in its short history. they've screwed over many people including thousands of han chinese.
i'm not a big fan of the prc's ruling regime but i'm not in complete disagreement about their thoughts on religion. while being good for people at times, religion has caused problems in the world throughout history. i can't say whether buddhism has been at the root of any international conflicts, but i'm pretty sure other religions have.
on tibet, i kind of feel sorry for china. they get a lot of crap (not entirely undeserved) and will for a long time because they are in tibet. they could have let another country suppress tibet and take the eternal blame :wink: maybe russia? at least it could be the "evil white man" doing it instead of chinese :wink:

[minimifidian]

"Britain then asked China's central Gov to pay war indemity.
After China paid the war indemity (more like ransom money) the invaders pulled out."

- this is incorrect. Britain asked the Tibetan Government to pay the indemnity, however, the Chinese paid it to try and imply their suzerainty over Tibet. In fact they had very little influence inside of Tibet.

[hummalumma]

...with the advent of the internet and disposable information at our fingertips and impending overall laziness, spreads the seeds of 'informational apathy', where verification is an after thought.

...yugaung is using cyber propaganda in his own convincing way- which is manipulative and of subterfuge and recrmination. He is not sympathetic to Tibet and his mandate is to protect the PRC's best interest.


www.tibet.ca