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DroppinScience
09-07-2004, 06:45 PM
Happy now, murderous warhawks?! :mad:

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http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&e=1&u=/ap/20040907/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq

U.S. Military Deaths in Iraq Pass 1,000

By HAMZA HENDAWI, Associated Press Writer

BAGHDAD, Iraq - U.S. military deaths in the Iraq (news - web sites) campaign passed the 1,000 milestone Tuesday, with more than 800 of them during the stubborn insurgency that flared after the Americans brought down Saddam Hussein (news - web sites) and President Bush (news - web sites) declared major combat over.

A spike in fighting with Sunni and Shiite insurgents killed seven Americans in the Baghdad area on Tuesday, pushing the count to 1,002. That number includes 999 U.S. troops and three civilians, two working for the U.S. Army and one for the Air Force. The tally was compiled by The Associated Press based on Pentagon (news - web sites) records and AP reporting from Iraq.


Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld cited progress on multiple fronts in the Bush administration's global war on terrorism and said U.S. enemies should not underestimate the willingness of the American people and its coalition allies to suffer casualties in Iraq and elsewhere.


"The progress has prompted a backlash, in effect, from those who hope that at some point we might conclude that the pain and the cost of this fight isn't worth it," Rumsfeld told a Pentagon news conference. "Well, our enemies have underestimated our country, our coalition. They have failed to understand the character of our people. And they certainly misread our commander in chief."


The Bush administration has long linked the Iraq conflict to the war on terrorism. The Sept. 11 Commission, however, concluded that Iraq and al-Qaida did not have a "collaborative relationship" before the 2001 attacks on New York and Washington, and some have questioned to what extent foreign terror groups are involved in the anti-U.S. insurgency in Iraq.


Democratic presidential candidate Sen. John Kerry (news - web sites) issued a statement saying the United States joined the friends and families of those who died in mourning their loss.


"Today marks a tragic milestone in the war in Iraq. More than one thousand of Americas sons and daughters have made the ultimate sacrifice. Our nation honors their service and joins with their families and loved ones in mourning their loss," Kerry said.


"We must never forget the price they have paid. And we must meet our sacred obligation to all our troops to do all we can to make the right decisions in Iraq so that we can bring them home as soon as possible."


The 1,002 figure includes deaths from hostile and non-hostile causes since the United States launched the Iraq campaign in March 2003 to topple Saddam's regime. The vast majority of U.S. deaths — all but 138 — came after Bush's May 1, 2003 declaration of an end to major combat operations. "Mission Accomplished," read a banner on an aircraft carrier where Bush made the announcement.


The U.S. military has not reported overall Iraqi deaths. The Iraqi Health Ministry started counting the dead only in April when heavy fighting broke out in Fallujah and Najaf. However, conservative estimates by private groups place the Iraqi toll at at least 10,000 — or 10 times the number of U.S. military deaths.


"It is difficult to establish the right number of casualties," said Amnesty International's Middle East spokeswoman, Nicole Choueiry. She added that "it was the job of the occupation power to keep track of the numbers but the Americans failed to do so."


The grim milestone of 1,000 American military deaths was surpassed after a surge in fighting, which has killed 16 U.S. service members in the past two days. Two soldiers died in clashes Tuesday with militiamen loyal to rebel Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr. Five other Americans died Tuesday in separate attacks, mostly in the Baghdad area. Seven Marines were killed Monday in a suicide car bombing north of Fallujah. Two soldiers were killed in a mortar attack Sunday.


West of the capital, U.S. warplanes swooped low over Fallujah on Tuesday in airstrikes after seven Marines and three Iraqi soldiers were killed the day before in a car-bombing near the Sunni insurgent-controlled city.


A group linked to Jordanian-born militant Abu Musab al-Zarqawi — Tawhid and Jihad — posted a statement on a militant Web site claiming responsibility for the attack, describing it as "a martyr operation ... that targeted American soldiers and their mercenary apostate collaborators from the Iraqi army."


Fighting between U.S. soldiers and al-Sadr's militiamen erupted Tuesday when U.S. officials said the cleric's gunmen fired on Americans carrying out patrols in the Sadr City district of Baghdad. Two Americans died in the fighting, U.S. officials said.


A senior Iraqi Health Ministry official, Saad al-Amili, said 35 Iraqis were killed and 203 wounded in the Sadr City clashes. An al-Sadr spokesman, Sheik Raed al-Kadhimi, blamed "intrusive" American patrolling for provoking the fighting.


"Our fighters have no choice but to return fire and to face the U.S. forces and helicopters pounding our houses," al-Kadhimi said in a statement.





Late Tuesday, the militia announced a unilateral cease-fire but said it would fight back in self defense. It was unclear whether the statement had any meaning since the militia routinely defends its actions as legitimate self defense.

U.S. Army Capt. Brian O'Malley said he was unaware of the cease-fire offer but that the area was quiet in the early evening. "We only fire when we are fired at, but we will not stop our patrols or withdraw from our positions," he said.

At the Pentagon, Gen. Richard Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, blamed the spike in U.S. combat deaths on an insurgency that "is becoming more sophisticated in its efforts to destabilize the country."

"We are aggressively seeking and capturing those insurgents who are not willing to do so themselves, but are encouraging people to commit suicide attacks," Myers told reporters Tuesday. "Make no mistake, we will continue to pursue those who seek to disrupt progress in Iraq."

During the Sadr City fighting, U.S. warplanes flew over the sprawling neighborhood — home to some 2 million people. American tanks, their turrets spinning, deployed in key intersections. Ambulances with sirens wailing rushed the wounded to hospitals as plumes of heavy, black smoke rose over the mainly Shiite neighborhood.

U.S. forces appeared to be carrying out most — if not all — of the fighting. No Iraqi security forces were seen during the clashes, though U.S. spokesmen talked of "multinational forces" involved in the operations, a term that sometimes includes Iraqi troops.

Small groups of al-Sadr's al-Mahdi Army fighters pounded on the asphalt with hammers to plant mines and explosives in the streets. Fighters in their teens and early 20s trotted toward the clashes — rocket-propelled grenades in hand — as children scampered behind them.

Other militiamen, rifles in hand, gathered on street corners. Fighters using rocks and tires blocked roads leading to the area. By afternoon, most stores in the neighborhood were shuttered.

Elsewhere, a bomb exploded Tuesday near the convoy of the governor of the Baghdad region, killing two people. Gov. Ali al-Haidri escaped injury, Interior Ministry spokesman Col. Adnan Abdel Rahman said.

In another part of the capital, armed men in olive green uniforms stormed the office of an Italian aid group and seized two Italian women and two Iraqis. It was only the second known kidnapping of foreign women since a wave of hostage-takings began this year. A female Japanese aid worker was captured in Fallujah in April but was released a week later.

travesty
09-07-2004, 07:05 PM
Did anyone else see the "countdown" on CNN. It was appaling as they kept counting the tally. Like they were waiting on the apple to drop at Times Square or like the 1000th's family would get a special prize. Weak and tasteless. We all know how may brave soldiers have been fed into the Iraqi meat grinder. It's in the paper every morning, I don't need a countdown.

Bob
09-07-2004, 07:18 PM
what do you mean, combat has been over for like a year

Tone Capone
09-07-2004, 07:53 PM
what do you mean, combat has been over for like a year

I hope that was sarcasm.

Rich Cheney
09-07-2004, 08:00 PM
You mean they weren't playing Chutes 'n' Ladders this whole time?

I'll be damned!

DroppinScience
09-07-2004, 08:50 PM
You mean they weren't playing Chutes 'n' Ladders this whole time?

I'll be damned!

Combat operations have been over for a year, as Bush tells me on the television. There shouldn't be ANYBODY dying after May 2003 man.

DroppinScience
09-07-2004, 08:52 PM
Did anyone else see the "countdown" on CNN. It was appaling as they kept counting the tally. Like they were waiting on the apple to drop at Times Square or like the 1000th's family would get a special prize. Weak and tasteless. We all know how may brave soldiers have been fed into the Iraqi meat grinder. It's in the paper every morning, I don't need a countdown.

Not as tasteless as sending them over there to die so oil pockets are lined.

travesty
09-07-2004, 09:31 PM
Not as tasteless as sending them over there to die so oil pockets are lined.

I know you are just trying to make a point, but I have to ask....

Do you truly believe, in your heart of hearts, that the ONLY reason the US invaded Iraq is so that a couple of big oil companies can make even more money?

Bob
09-07-2004, 09:32 PM
Combat operations have been over for a year, as Bush tells me on the television. There shouldn't be ANYBODY dying after May 2003 man.

that's what i was getting at, it was sarcasm, yeah

DroppinScience
09-07-2004, 10:49 PM
I know you are just trying to make a point, but I have to ask....

Do you truly believe, in your heart of hearts, that the ONLY reason the US invaded Iraq is so that a couple of big oil companies can make even more money?

It's not the only reason. There are a bunch more:

-So Bush can defend Daddy's "embarrassment" in '91
-Colonizing the Middle East (good ol' fashioned European-style imperialism!)
-So defense contractors can get LOTS of money (ah, the military industrial complex)
-It's the easiest target to get the American people riled up for war (N. Korea off-limits because they'd be able to put up a very brutal fight and nuke S. Korea and Japan)
-To distract everyone from the fact that Osama Bin Laden is still at large

Oh and let's face it, to the Bush junta, war just makes them very very happy. They like to flex their muscles and blow things up.

I'm sure there's more reasons Bush went to war. But of all the potential reasons: WMDs, "liberating" the Iraqi people, links to al-Qaeda, democracy in the Middle East, etc. are about as credible as the Easter Bunny.

D_Raay
09-07-2004, 10:56 PM
Wait Wait
THERE ARE PEOPLE ON HERE WHO FIND YOUR POSTINGS OBJECTIONABLE. THEY DON'T WANT TO HAVE TO READ YOUR POLITICAL RAMBLINGS. THEY ARE TEDIOUS RETREAD NONSENSE THAT HAVE NO PLACE ON A POLITICAL FORUM. TRUTH IS TRUTH BUT TRUTH IS BORING. :rolleyes:

travesty
09-07-2004, 11:31 PM
It's not the only reason. There are a bunch more:

-So Bush can defend Daddy's "embarrassment" in '91
-Colonizing the Middle East (good ol' fashioned European-style imperialism!)
-So defense contractors can get LOTS of money (ah, the military industrial complex)
-It's the easiest target to get the American people riled up for war (N. Korea off-limits because they'd be able to put up a very brutal fight and nuke S. Korea and Japan)
-To distract everyone from the fact that Osama Bin Laden is still at large

Oh and let's face it, to the Bush junta, war just makes them very very happy. They like to flex their muscles and blow things up.

I'm sure there's more reasons Bush went to war. But of all the potential reasons: WMDs, "liberating" the Iraqi people, links to al-Qaeda, democracy in the Middle East, etc. are about as credible as the Easter Bunny.

I like to blow things up too....really looking forward to the assault rifle ban running out next Monday, can't wait to get me a spanking new Uzi! (I'll start that in a new thread)

No really, the reason I asked is just that you seem so vitriolic about the whole thing I wanted to make sure that at some point since this war started that you considered the possibility that maybe, just maybe our president was actually trying to make things better. Granted things have gone to shit since day one, but I don't think that the whole decision was a simple as "lining the oil companies pockets" Maybe you do.
I know that giving Bushy a modicum of respect is beyond most posters on this board, but I just can't bring myself to be that pessimistic and simplistic about the whole deal.

bilbo
09-07-2004, 11:38 PM
I hope that was sarcasm.


whewshhhh goes the sound as once again another point flies over noggin' of confused pudding head

Nighty-night :p
zzzzzzzzzz

travesty
09-08-2004, 08:26 AM
The other night I had a bad feeling this will last for a long time....there was no exit strategy!


And there still isn't one. I don't think either candidate has answered that one well enough for me to sleep better at night.

Bob
09-08-2004, 09:32 AM
maybe they never planned to exit

travesty
09-08-2004, 09:36 AM
maybe they never planned to exit

HMMMMMMMM, the 51st state, New Iraq? Some of those palaces would make sweet casinos.

D_Raay
09-08-2004, 10:37 AM
It really sucks that some of the people who serve this Great Nation have died.

I whish no one ever had to die. The cost of freedom is not cheap !!!!
Who's freedom? The Iraquis? I thought you hated them Arabs? It certainly wasn't a question of our freedom being threatened from Iraq.

Rich Cheney
09-08-2004, 10:53 AM
Combat operations have been over for a year, as Bush tells me on the television. There shouldn't be ANYBODY dying after May 2003 man.

You do have a vaild point there; I fault GW on making a pre-mature statement.

IceGargoylle
09-08-2004, 11:14 AM
It certainly wasn't a question of our freedom being threatened from Iraq.


it most cetainly was and if ppl cant see that, there is a big problem.

frisky girl
09-08-2004, 11:28 AM
Buckle your seatbelts, ladies and gentleman: if Bush is re-elected, there'll be more fun and games to come. Next on the hit list: Iran. Wonder how all you war-hungry folks will feel if the draft gets reinstated?

MoTownFUNK
09-08-2004, 12:17 PM
1000, that's it?

MoTownFUNK
09-08-2004, 12:19 PM
HMMMMMMMM, the 51st state, New Iraq? Some of those palaces would make sweet casinos.

I thought the 51st was the U.P. of Michigan.

D_Raay
09-08-2004, 12:53 PM
It certainly wasn't a question of our freedom being threatened from Iraq.


it most cetainly was and if ppl cant see that, there is a big problem.
Prove it.

IceGargoylle
09-08-2004, 03:52 PM
havent we lost over 4000 peeps?

anyway, the guy tried to kill a pres., was gonna buy nuclear material(france, UK, italy confiirmed this), alrdy had ~2200 lbs. of radioactive material. the weapons we did find thhus far are enuf to kill ~500k peeps, the shells poland found werent even listed on the UN declaration saddam gave them, seed stock was found in a top officials home-germs, and not to mention ew did find nuclear weapon making equipment, parts of which have been on display for the media.

now having said that. are we to believe that this guy has no intention of carrying out an attack on US soil, emabassies or bases? are we to believe that he has no conection with A.Q.? A.Q. was in his country, he paid 20k to the families of suicide bombers, he has himself links to A.Q., officers in his army are also A.Q. officers, Bin Ladin has contacted him before.

lets see, oh and not to mention that he has killed, lets say conservatively 400k of his own peeps not including rapes tortures, disfigurement, amputations.

he was a liar, a killer, a madman with lots of money--AND he had france, germany, and russia selling him military goods through the oil for food program!

put that in your pipe and smoke it.

bilbo
09-08-2004, 03:54 PM
he has himself links to A.Q., officers in his army are also A.Q. officers, Bin Ladin has contacted him before.

La-la-la-la-la-liarrrrrr
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0616-01.htm

Sucks to be you. (n)

IceGargoylle
09-08-2004, 04:04 PM
oops.... didnt relate all that to OUR FREEDOM....please excuse me:

lets go back int he time machine to 9/10. everythings good for the most part. we can fly places, we can go to the mall, go to the movie theater, gas was cheaper, etc. now we all woke up on 9/11 thinking the same eol' thing. but on 9/11, over 3k americans were sluaghtered with airplanes. what happens aafter that? airlines get hit, ppl lose jobs, the economy took a big hit.

you get my point yet?

that was 4 planes and 3 buildings. now imagine something bigger, perhaps biological or nuclear. wwe arent talking about 3 buildings and 3k peeps anymore. new york for example, we are talkng about a potential of 8-10 million americans being affected. what do you think will happen to the US economy then? where will your freedom be then? in the shitter with millions of dead Americans all becuase of a couple pounds of biological weapons or a few ounces of nuclear material.

our freedom is directly related to alot of things, but really it boils down to the economy. we can really be free, we could live off the land, eat berries. is thta what you are thinking?

IceGargoylle
09-08-2004, 04:05 PM
911 report has much of this.

bilbo...are that inept to believe that a super rich wacko murder didnt? how can you honestly belive that notion? can you honestly believe that he didnt have wmd's? a guy who lead the inspectors around for 11 fucking years? showing them what he wanted them to see....man.

bilbo
09-08-2004, 04:15 PM
911 report has much of this.
bilbo...are that inept to believe that a super rich wacko murder didnt? how can you honestly belive that notion? can you honestly believe that he didnt have wmd's? .

Which super rich "wacko murder" are you talking about?

Where the fuck are the 25,000 litres of anthrax, 38,000 litres of botulism toxin, 500 tons of sarin, mustard, and VX nerve agent, 30,000 artillery shells capable of delivering chemical agents? :confused:

The 911 report says there is no link. If you're going to lie, do it about something that isn't easily fact checked. For Christ's sake, it's posted all over the internet. :rolleyes:

D_Raay
09-08-2004, 04:31 PM
911 report has much of this.

bilbo...are that inept to believe that a super rich wacko murder didnt? how can you honestly belive that notion? can you honestly believe that he didnt have wmd's? a guy who lead the inspectors around for 11 fucking years? showing them what he wanted them to see....man.
You are the worst kind of Right wing nut. Your facts aren't correct, but you're hell bent on saying them anyway. SADDAM DID NOT ATTACK US. Even with the loads of spin they couldn't fool anyone with this. SADDAM DID NOT ATTACK US.
We are occupiers and invaders to a sovereign nation. Saudi Arabia funded Al-Quaeda not Saddam. Just face it, all the lies are adding up so much they can't keep track of them anymore. It's a good thing for them in a way what with the media's ADD because of it, but ultimately it will bite them in the ass. Watch when they lose how they descend upon each other and start the whistleblowing. It will be site to behold. And then I can confidently reiterate my earlier statement "Worst president ever".

frisky girl
09-08-2004, 04:35 PM
You are the worst kind of Right wing nut. Your facts aren't correct, but you're hell bent on saying them anyway. SADDAM DID NOT ATTACK US. Even with the loads of spin they couldn't fool anyone with this. SADDAM DID NOT ATTACK US.
We are occupiers and invaders to a sovereign nation. Saudi Arabia funded Al-Quaeda not Saddam. Just face it, all the lies are adding up so much they can't keep track of them anymore. It's a good thing for them in a way what with the media's ADD because of it, but ultimately it will bite them in the ass. Watch when they lose how they descend upon each other and start the whistleblowing. It will be site to behold. And then I can confidently reiterate my earlier statement "Worst president ever".

I'll second that.

travesty
09-08-2004, 04:44 PM
It certainly wasn't a question of our freedom being threatened from Iraq.


it most cetainly was and if ppl cant see that, there is a big problem.

For what it's worth........

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/3819057.stm

EN[i]GMA
09-08-2004, 05:43 PM
How was our freedom threatened? His ties with Al Qaeda? His nuclear program? His weapons of mass destruction?

bilbo
09-08-2004, 06:01 PM
The fact that the liars in the Bush administration never mentioned the Russian intelligence in its arguments for going to war speaks volumes as to what kind of shabby information the warning detailed. In that report Putin himself said there was no evidence that Saddam's regime was involved in any terrorist attacks. :rolleyes:

Funkaloyd
09-08-2004, 06:31 PM
http://www.workingforchange.com/comic.cfm?itemid=14670

Love that shit.

travesty
09-08-2004, 06:37 PM
http://www.workingforchange.com/comic.cfm?itemid=14670

Love that shit.

(y) (y)