A challenge to Racer and ILL.......

[Qdrop]

I want EACH of you to explain evolution as YOU understand it, in YOUR OWN WORDS.

i want to see what your level of understanding is on this.

[Qdrop]

Why are you doing this?

You are a masochist arent you?

"Bring out the Gimp."

just trying to prove a point.....



leave my gimp out of this......he's a good man.
;)

[racer5.0stang]

What would be the point, in your own words, of this exercise?

Should I in return ask you to explain, in your own words, creation according to the bible?

Just a couple of questions.

[Qdrop]

What would be the point, in your own words, of this exercise?

Should I in return ask you to explain, in your own words, creation according to the bible?

Just a couple of questions.

STOP STALLING.

START WRITING.

[Qdrop]

I have to agree with this.

To what end? So you can point and laugh? That isnt very noble.

so they (with thier own brains) can see why evolution doesn't make sense to them and other creationists....and can have that corrected.
the majority of thier disbeliefs of evolution comes from a complete misunderstanding of the entire concept and biology in general.

but telling them this has no effect.

they must be made to face thier fears.....thier own beliefs.

it's judgement day.


start writing, boys!!

[100% ILL]

The Theory OF Evolution

By: 100% ILL

Once I was an amoeba, which lived in the sea....

Then I was a monkey, who lived in a tree.......

Now I'm a scientist with a Ph D!!!!!

:D (y)

[yeahwho]

Racer, ILL, explain Gilligans Island vs. The Real Gilligans Island. Go.

[racer5.0stang]

Well Qdrop, here it goes even though I don't expect you to understand.

It is all about faith. You have undoubtly put your faith in man. You have said these scientists are smart and have the technology so they must be right. I also have faith in man. I have faith that the technicians that built my automobile did so in a profesional manner it will perform in a satisfactory way. I also have faith in doctors. When I am injured or sick that they will provide the correct medicine to help my body to heal.

But on the flip side I have put my faith in God to tell me of my origins. If God says hey I created you, then I through faith have accepted that. Just as you have accepted that man has said we evolved from pond scum.

It is a matter of faith.

[Qdrop]

STOP STALLING.

START WRITING.

[Qdrop]

The Theory OF Evolution

By: 100% ILL

Once I was an amoeba, which lived in the sea....

Then I was a monkey, who lived in a tree.......

Now I'm a scientist with a Ph D!!!!!

:D (y)

STOP STALLING.
START WRITING.

[Qdrop]

Well Qdrop, here it goes even though I don't expect you to understand.

It is all about faith. You have undoubtly put your faith in man. You have said these scientists are smart and have the technology so they must be right. I also have faith in man. I have faith that the technicians that built my automobile did so in a profesional manner it will perform in a satisfactory way. I also have faith in doctors. When I am injured or sick that they will provide the correct medicine to help my body to heal.

But on the flip side I have put my faith in God to tell me of my origins. If God says hey I created you, then I through faith have accepted that. Just as you have accepted that man has said we evolved from pond scum.

It is a matter of faith.
explain the theory of evolution as you understand it.

stop stalling.
start writing.

[Qdrop]

But why?

We were created. End of story. Doesnt matter, on this message board, how or why we were. We just were.

i think you just like pointing your finger a little too much. You like telling other people why they are wrong. There is nothing noble in that, as you are trying to convince me ^^.

Aimee, have you read these guys posts?
do you have any idea how frustrating these 2 rubber ducks are?

they spend 90% of their time quoting the bible and saying how christianity is the true path...and how evolution and science is flawed...YET THEY DON'T EVEN UNDERSTAND IT!

i want to document this...for them and for all others to see.

the Bible Twins categorically have no idea what they are talking about.

hey Bible twins: consider this a test of your faith. you cannot backdown if you love your God.

take this challenge.
challenge your faith.

true, you don't have to prove it to me or to anyone else here...

but you want to.
otherwise, this will fucking haunt you.......and i'll make sure it does.
MAN UP!

[Qdrop]

I have seen what they post, so why are you encouraging more. You HONESTLY think they will do what you ask?

They wont. They will do as they HAVE done and post more shit to piss you off.

that isnt why they normally do it, but that is why they will now.

i just want to document thier cowardliness in this thread.
i want to expose them for what they really are: WEAK FAITHED followers.

WE ALL know why they won't take this challenge, as do they.
they DON'T understand the very thing they doubt.

they don't doubt it for any scientific reasons (though they claim otherwise), they doubt it out of fear.
the fear that it contradicts what they believe.
it puts a crack in thier foundation.

i want to document this....so i can refer them to it in the future.


i am sorry to offend/annoy you aimee. really.
i just had to make this point.
sorry.

[100% ILL]

evolution

concept that embodies the belief that existing animals and plants developed by a process of gradual, continuous change from previously existing forms. This theory, also known as descent with modification, constitutes organic evolution. Inorganic evolution, on the other hand, is concerned with the development of the physical universe from unorganized matter. Organic evolution, as opposed to belief in the special creation of each individual species as an immutable form, conceives of life as having had its beginnings in a simple primordial protoplasmic mass (probably originating in the sea) from which, through the long eras of time, arose all subsequent living forms.

[Qdrop]

evolution

concept that embodies the belief that existing animals and plants developed by a process of gradual, continuous change from previously existing forms. This theory, also known as descent with modification, constitutes organic evolution. Inorganic evolution, on the other hand, is concerned with the development of the physical universe from unorganized matter. Organic evolution, as opposed to belief in the special creation of each individual species as an immutable form, conceives of life as having had its beginnings in a simple primordial protoplasmic mass (probably originating in the sea) from which, through the long eras of time, arose all subsequent living forms.

nice cut and paste.

now in your own words.

i want you to explain in some significant detail....how the fist forms of life arose from non-living material...and how those forms evolved to more advanced forms.......from mulitcellular to fish, to reptile, to mammal, to primate.
AND WHY THEY EVOLVED.
that is the key part.

yes....it will be somewhat long...but this will prove my point.

DO NOT CHEAT!.....FROM YOUR OWN BRAIN, GODDAMMIT!

[100% ILL]

i want you to explain in some significant detail....how the fist forms of life arose from non-living material...and how those forms evolved to more advanced forms.......from mulitcellular to fish, to reptile, to mammal, to primate.
AND WHY THEY EVOLVED.
that is the key part.

yes....it will be somewhat long...but this will prove my point.

And out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air.
Genesis 2:19

And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
Genesis 3:7


For by Him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible.........all things were created by him and for him. And he is before all things and by him all things consist.
Colossians 1:16-17

Thou art worthy, O Lord, to recieve glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.
Revelation 4:11

Wherefore wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare if thou hast understanding.
Job 38:4

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. All things were made by him; and without him was not anything made that was made.
John 1:1,3

He stretcheth out the north over the empty palce, and hangeth the earth upon nothing.
Job 26:7

[Mac D]

what is the point of this thread qdrop? who cares what people think of evolution. people can have different opinions...

[Qdrop]

more bible quotes, huh?



the Bible Twins are cowards.


you don't understand evolution on any significant level....never have.

you don't doubt it for any scientific reasons......just for faith based ones.
and this proves it.

your posts about the scientific reasons you doubt evolution are SHAMS.
just cut and pastes from other creationist sites.

you are just parroting the mantra's of other creationists....without even understanding them.

you are blind faith followers.....

sheep.

lemmings.

this thread will haunt you.

you lose.
good day, sir.

[Mac D]

haha u are so retarded, what a dumb thread

[Qdrop]

what is the point of this thread qdrop? who cares what people think of evolution. people can have different opinions...


go back to the other sections....this isn't your debate.

you have no history of what this thread is about......it's more personal.

i was attacking thier false claims and subversive debate tactics from numerous other threads in the past.

it's over now.

[Mac D]

i actually post here the most... one of the few that represents the republicans

[Mac D]

yea big time endangered

[Qdrop]

one of the few that represents the republicans

well, i suppose that's good for balance.
this board is over run by overly ideological liberals, who btw, tend to be FAR more rude and inciniary than me.

anyway, it's over.

[Qdrop]

Oh my god.

Arent you like an endangered species?

on this board, yes.

but in this country, *sigh* they are the fucking majority.

[Mac D]

on this board, yes.

but in this country, *sigh* they are the fucking majority.


haha, well at least 18+ yrs and plus. almost everyone in high school is a democrat unless u are in the way deep south. dont worry qdrop unless rudy g. runs in '08 help (obama) is probably on the way for you. not that big of a fan of GWB myself, but damn he is way better than kerry.

[100% ILL]

Well, I'm glad you won.
:)

I was rooting for you the whole time. I get tired of seeing people come on here and badger you for your views.

[100% ILL]

The whole point is Q-drop, that there is so much more to life than the physical and what you can see. This external view is what causes men to look to science to "prove" our exsistence. In the long run it really doesn't matter what you or I "think" is true. All that matters is what really is true. If you choose to believe there is no God,then, that is your business. God gives every man a free will to choose.He certainly doesn't want to drag you kicking and screaming into heaven if you do not want to be there.

There really is no point to this "explain to me in your own words what evolution is" because I simply do not believe it. Not everything of value is tangible. To me the earth and physical life is a temporary place. The body is no more than a vehicle in which resides your soul. The soul will live forever, the body will die and rot. I know you don't care and you figure that I'm just a blind "lemming" as you put it.

I choose to believe God.

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and not of yourselves: It is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Ephesians 2:8-10

Whereas ye know not what shall be on the morrow. For what is your life? It is even a vapor, that appeareth for a little time, and then vanisheth away
James 4:14

And it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment.
Hebrews 9:27

[yeahwho]

OK. Thats it. You want the truth? You can't handle the truth! (http://members.tripod.com/TTLF/gilligan.html)

[racer5.0stang]

OK. Thats it. You want the truth? You can't handle the truth! (http://members.tripod.com/TTLF/gilligan.html)

That was pretty funny (y)

[racer5.0stang]

more bible quotes, huh?



the Bible Twins are cowards.


you don't understand evolution on any significant level....never have.

you don't doubt it for any scientific reasons......just for faith based ones.
and this proves it.

your posts about the scientific reasons you doubt evolution are SHAMS.
just cut and pastes from other creationist sites.

you are just parroting the mantra's of other creationists....without even understanding them.

you are blind faith followers.....

sheep.

lemmings.

this thread will haunt you.

you lose.
good day, sir.


Proverbs 26:4

Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.

[yeahwho]

Proverbs 26:4

Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.

That was pretty funny (y)

[QueenAdrock]

not that big of a fan of GWB myself, but damn he is way better than kerry.


HAHAHA

I haven't laughed that hard in quite some time.

[Burnout18]

If the bible is real...then doesn't that mean we are all EXTREMELY inbred?

yea. If u think about it, then yes.

[Ace42]

evolution

concept that embodies the belief that existing animals and plants developed by a process of gradual, continuous change from previously existing forms. This theory, also known as descent with modification, constitutes organic evolution. Inorganic evolution, on the other hand, is concerned with the development of the physical universe from unorganized matter. Organic evolution, as opposed to belief in the special creation of each individual species as an immutable form, conceives of life as having had its beginnings in a simple primordial protoplasmic mass (probably originating in the sea) from which, through the long eras of time, arose all subsequent living forms.

http://www.crystalinks.com/evolution.html

Didn't he say *in your own words* ?

Or was post #6's quote a horrible fiction?

[yeahwho]

Why do we have to drift along a stream of time?

"It's just nature's way of making sure everything doesn't happen at once."

[Rosie Cotton]

The whole point is Q-drop, that there is so much more to life than the physical and what you can see. This external view is what causes men to look to science to "prove" our exsistence.
Wow, spoken like a true pothead.

I gotta agree with every reasonable person on here Q, what is the point of this? You keep saying it's documentation, but this is a message board. It's been documented plenty of times. This just seems downright mean-spirited, and it's a complete waste of bandwidth.

[ASsman]

Why did God give me such a large penis? Do I have a mission in life?

[Ace42]

I gotta agree with every reasonable person on here Q, what is the point of this? You keep saying it's documentation, but this is a message board. It's been documented plenty of times. This just seems downright mean-spirited, and it's a complete waste of bandwidth.

What, Q-drop is an antagonistic troll? Well colour me shocked.

[Qdrop]

Ace, stay off my threads.......
fuck, you can't even read them.

it's funny how you loathe me, yet we have common ground on more than half of our beliefs......but that is another story....


THE POINT of this thread is to documment that both ILL and RACER's doubt in evolution and science is NOT SCIENTIFICALLY BASED as they have claimed before hand.
it is purely faith based.

See, most people on here, PARTICULARLY ACE, do not know how to argue against a creationist.
you cannot fall for all there little debate tricks.
Ace, time after time, will argue for pages and pages.....splitting hairs, letting the debate get seguayed in semantics and definitions.....
this what creationists want. they want the argument to go on forever, delving into philosophy and such.
that is how they stalemate you.....

creationists CLAIM that they have scientific reasoning behind their doubts in evolution.
they do not.

in order to beat a creationist at their own game....you must not let them play it the way they want: giving them openings to spew out thier pre-written rhetoric they got from creationsit websites : how did the human eye evolve? what about fossil gaps? ect)

you must take a step back and not get caught up in their "details".
you must force them to admit what they are: faith based lemmings.

issuing a challenge such as this forces them to show their true colors.

while most of us already knew this.......NOW THEY ARE FORCED TO ADMIT TO IT THEMSELVES.
and now, if they attempt to make any other "scientific claims" against evolution or any other science that challenges thier beliefs....they can be directed back to this thread, which shows that it is a ruse, and thier disbelief stems purely from pig-headed arrogance in thier religion.

no 5 page, hair-splitting debates......

call a spade a spade.

sometimes, you gotta be dickhead to get anything accomplished. :rolleyes:

[Qdrop]

What, Q-drop is an antagonistic troll? Well colour me shocked.


what? Ace making an antogonistic, troll-like remark about others being antagonistic trolls?
i, too, am shocked.

[ASsman]

I have a challenge. Who can read the Bible the fastest.. In Hebrew!

[100% ILL]

You have proven nothing. The fact that I do not believe in evolution and that I have faith in God comes as a surprise to no one.

You remind me of a twelve year old boy, what with your high-handed remarks about beating the creationists at their own game.

The fundamental core of your argument is based on your presuppostion and that evolution is a fact. You do nothing but sight your articles explaining
your position while I have offered an equal number to the contrary. The creation/evolution debate is still ongoing in the scientific community, yet you behave as though you have conclusively proven a great truth here.

http://www.commonsensescience.org/


Common Sense Science reflects the Judeo-Christian and Muslim Worldview that is based on three unprovable but reasonable assumptions:

Reality
The world is real, and we can understand the nature of that reality. Objects are durable and continue to exist whether or not we think about them (see Vedantic Philosophy) and whether or not we observe them (see Quantum Reality)
Causality
Events in the universe follow the law of cause and effect. Every event has a preceeding cause. For example, a electron with negative charge is attracted by a proton with opposite charge and moves toward it. It doesn't move without a reason.
Unity
Nature is unified in two major ways. First, the forces between objects follows the same laws of physics whether the objects are large as galaxies or small as atomic nuclei. Second, the design and structure of atoms is the same everywhere in the universe. Hot hydrogen gas emits the same colors of light whether the light comes from a distant galaxy or from a laboratory on earth.

Although these assumptions of reality, causality and unity seem self-evident to many people, Modern Science is built upon some opposite assumptions of quantum reality, randomness, and multiplicity of force laws.

Contradictions in Modern Physics


The modern theory of matter rests upon such supporting theories as the Standard Model of Elementary Particles, Quantum Mechanics, and the Special Theory of Relativity. After decades of work by thousands of physicists, the theory has "grown" until it can explain a very large body of physical phenomena. This has made the theory very successful; but the theory is not adequate or true because:

1. It is only a mathematical model consisting of equations and does not usually specify physical structure for elementary particles.
2. It frequently contradicts itself.
3. It provides no mechanism for such fundamental processes as the exchange of energy.
4. It has to rely upon numerous assumptions.

The Many Myths of Evolution

http://www.scienceagainstevolution.org/topics.htm

Creation of Life

It is popularly believed that experiments have been done that showed that the chemicals present in the early Earth's oceans and atmosphere could have formed amino acids, which could have combined to form proteins, which eventually turned into the first living cell. This myth arose from the publication of the results of experiments done by Miller 9 and Fox. 10

On March 28, 1997, we showed the video. "Is Life Just Chemistry?" in which Michael Girouard, M.D., showed that these experiments did not prove that amino acids and proteins could have formed naturally. In fact, they prove that life could not have happened that way.

After we showed the video, our favorite critic complained that we had taken a cheap shot by bringing up Miller and Fox. He said that those two series of experiments had been done more than 40 years ago, and that the errors in them are well known. He said that everybody knows that those experiments led nowhere, and that no respectable scientists are doing work along those lines. He said modern research into the origin of life is taking other approaches, but has not produced any positive results yet.

We agree with everything our critic said, except for the part that "everybody knows" it. It is our position that the general public does not know that these experiments failed and mistakenly believes that they succeeded.

One reason we believe that many people are misinformed is because the previously mentioned local high school text 11 presents the work of Miller and Fox as if it were long-established scientific proof of how life evolved.





Darwinism

Darwin revived the theory of evolution by doing what Lamark could not do. He supplied a plausible mechanism for descent with modification. He correctly observed: (1) there is a certain amount of variation in offspring; (2) there are more offspring produced than can survive; (3) in the fight for survival, the best variants live and the worst variants die. He correctly concluded that this gradually causes small, but noticeable, changes in species.

Darwin then extrapolated this truth into non-truth. He believed that these gradual changes could continue without limit, resulting in changes so large that entirely new species would evolve. He believed that when more fossils were found, the fossil record would show evidence of these gradual changes. But after more than 130 years of searching, those fossils have not been found.

[Ace42]

Ill, next time you cite an article, could you at least attempt to make sure it isn't a load of bollocks?

Even a cursory understanding of the scientific theories mentioned in the stuff you cut and pasted would show that whoever wrote it had a very limited understanding of the theories he was attempting to debunk.

Also, while the argument between Evolutionary-creation and spontaneous / deified creationism might persist, the latter case has no basis in fact whatsoever.

And the fundamentalist Christian view of creationism (7 days, etc etc) is *not* being debated. It is false. There are no two ways about it.

To say it is "still being argued" is to say that "it isn't certain that grass is green, because one raving loon keeps shouting 'It's purple!'"

I appreciate you making an effort to engage in the subject scientifically, however the fact that you are disregarding scientific fact in favour of a terribly misrepresented simplification of it proves nothing other than your limited understanding of the matter.

The fact that equally ill-informed individuals have written teribly innaccurate artiles in agreement with you does not change the fact.

Also, why not read up on quantum theory, because judging by the cut and paste job, it seems that your source has problems with something that is demonstrably correct.

Quantum computer prototypes have been designed that use fundamental premises of quantum theory in order to operate. They work (in a purely experimental manner, they cannot be *used* practically yet, even though they work well enough to prove the theories they operate on) and thus you cannot refute Quantum Theory as "scientific mumbo-jumbo."

Likewise questioning relativity is backwards. Various aspects of relativity have been proven by experiments. To say they are "false" is to argue with fact.

[100% ILL]

"We have educated ourselves into imbecility,"

http://www.rzim.org/publications/jttran.php?seqid=22

[Ace42]

Again, you post an opinion piece which is devoid of any critical thinking whatsoever. This is Sisko's tactic, and look where it got him. Seriously, if this is the best you can do, then don't.

[Schmeltz]

Yes, that's exactly it, 100%Ill. The rise of secularism was an evil conspiracy designed to turn people away from Jesus. There's no substance to it at all. What an earth-shaking revelation you've provided for us there.

[Qdrop]

What I would be more interested in, is an explanation for christians who believe in the theory of evolution.

Like the two can never be mixed?

you see elements of that with Intelligent Design.

the basic belief is that science and evolution are supported....but underneath it all is GOD.
meaning: yeah evolution is cool....but only cause God made it that way and guided it all the way.

and the universe shows "undisputable evidence" that there is a design to it by a higher intelligence.
the universe is simply too complex to happen by chance.

basically, the belief is "science WITHOUT chance."




what it really is ....is a backdoor approach by creationists.....so they can be taken seriously by science.
it's still a farce with no substantial evidence.

[Ace42]

What I would be more interested in, is an explanation for christians who believe in the theory of evolution.

Like the two can never be mixed?

'Rationalist Unitarianism' - God is one being Who consists of one person - the Father. Jesus is not the Son of God, but merely a "good and wise man" who taught others how to lead a better life. Rationalist Unitarianism emerged from the German Rationalism of the 19th Century. Its proponents took a highly intellectual approach to religion, rejecting most of the miraculous events in the Bible (including the virgin birth.) They embraced evolutionary concepts, asserted the "inherent goodness of man" and abandoned many principles of Christianity. James Martineau (1805-1900) was one of their most prominent members. Rationalist Unitarianism is distinguished from Deism (with which it nevertheless shares many features) by the fact that RUs believe in a personal deity Who interacts with His creation, while Deists see God as an impersonal force which remains aloof from creation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarianism

[59 Chrystie St.]

I was wondering out there who believes that Jesus was a black Hebrew ? The white image of Christ is Cesare Borgia, the son of Pope Alexander the VI (1492). Don't some of you realize that the all the Christian holidays coincide with the Pagan holidays of Rome ? Rome was a pretty messed up place back in the late 15th century and were fighting wars with arabic muslims. The reason they "white" washed Christ was to gain followers in attempts to win this war. How could these caucasions fight against the people who look like their savior. Think about it, it relates even more significantly today.

[racer5.0stang]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarianism


In other words, a Jehovah Witness or Mormon.

[Ace42]

Why not look up Jehovah's witnesses and Mormonism before saying stupid things like that?

Unitarians are incredibly different from either of those.

[100% ILL]

http://www.mormon.org/learn/0,8672,1092-1,00.html

http://www.jw-media.org/beliefs/trueworship.htm

[Whois]

Follow in the footsteps of the one true god:

Bubba Ho Tep!

http://www.bubbahotep.com

[Ace42]

www.subgenius.com

[Qdrop]

Follow in the footsteps of the one true god:

Bubba Ho Tep!

http://www.bubbahotep.com

great movie!
(y)

[100% ILL]

http://www.moron.com/

[yeahwho]

www.subgenius.com
Ahhh, yes, endtimes with Bob. (y)

[100% ILL]

faith based lemmings.i
sometimes, you gotta be dickhead to get anything accomplished. :rolleyes:


www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/you.html

[Qdrop]

www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/you.html


yes.......truly a dickhead.

[racer5.0stang]

www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/you.html

What was that all a/b?

[Whois]

Ahhh, yes, endtimes with Bob. (y)

...and not just once, but over, and over, and over.

:D

I think they're up to XXXXX - Day.

[ASsman]

Historic Unitarianism believed in the oneness of God as opposed to traditional Christian belief in the Trinity (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit). Historic Unitarians believed in the moral authority, but not the deity, of Jesus. - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarians

Wait don't they call the their Church "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints". The "Mormons" that is.

[racer5.0stang]

http://www.carm.org/jw/nutshell.htm (http://)

http://www.carm.org/lds/nutshell.htm (http://)