Bombardier and Nortel vs. Tibetan cultural...

[hummalumma]

...preservation.


The Han chinese are already outnumbering the Tibetans in Lhasa at more than 7 to 1. When the railway gets finished, I suspect that it may spell out the beginning of the end for Tibetan culture.

The cheapest things to buy in Lhasa is cigarettes and alcohol. Why?
To screw over the youth and corrupt them. They no longer speak Tibetan and have to speak chinese, so that they can get jobs and an education.
A complete and utter annexation. They are like strangers in their own country. Living in paranoia. No self determination or religious freedom.
Buddhism is such a peaceful way of life. It is incomprehensible to me.

Guess who is helping this railway process? Canadian comapnies such as Nortel and Bombardier.

Is there a solution? Does anyone have any ideas on how to stop this tragedy?

[milleson]

Is there a chance that this rail line may have a positive impact? Could the additional economic stimulus contribute to the Tibetan cause?

Perhaps once it is completed western tourists will have the opportunity to experience what is left of Tibetan culture.

Maybe this will be like the tale of the farmer whose horse ran off. Commenting on the loss, he said, "We shall see if this is good or if this is bad." The horse comes back bringing a mare with him. When the townspeople declared how lucky he was, he replied, "Who knows if this is lucky or unlucky?" One day the farmer's son was racing the horses across a field. He fell and broke both of his legs. The farmer replied, "We shall see whether this is good or if this is bad." Soon a war broke out. All the men in the village were called to fight, the only exception being the injured boy. When the neighbors again commented on his good fortune, he said nothing at all.

I think perhaps we should wait and see what results from the development of the rail line into Tibet. "We shall see if this is good or if this is bad."

[MC Moot]

[QUOTE=hummalumma Guess who is helping this railway process? Canadian comapnies such as Nortel and Bombardier.

Is there a solution? Does anyone have any ideas on how to stop this tragedy?[/QUOTE]


"Multinationals spreading like a rash".....and who's making it easy for corporations and conglomerates to do business in occupied Tibet?
It's Wolfowitz and the World Bank. An organization that provides the logistics,capital and infrastructure required to create a climate for gross profiteering and the cultural dilution that is occuring at an ever increasing rate....restructuring the World Bank and the W.T.O would be a good start. Hold them accountable and ensure that human rights take precedence over economic lust,development or greed.

[ericg]

Yeah, I tried to think along those lines too milleson... flow with the punches the best way possible, and who knows... their profound teachings and ways hopefully are still alive and well within them that could perhaps win and take advantage even with this annex.. A way to eat the monster from the inside out... But it still sits with me that the Chinese powers that be there are wrong and have certainly NOT brought or ever will bring any good there!!! so in those terms... there's really no way to make a good situation out of something so wrong, that will only help the aggressor's evil seed agenda. But like you said, I too believe in being still and making good time with anything that comes my way... but sometimes it doesn't cut the mustard. Don't go saying that to everything... "We shall see if Bush... Iraq..." Waiting to see when you know better on the off chance... only because it seems there's nothing to be done is no way to make it right and can be the worst option... Everything's to be done... the problem is that no one's giving it the time of day, or given themselves or life a chance... found the balls yet to do it and stay with it! Believing in a good, higher and greater power in life is where it's at, (life within, life itself... meaning of life which can only be good...) it really is figured out well with experience... rather than placing it with the powers riding negative currents. Life means more and is consumated then. "What the bleep do we know" I know.

[ericg]

And MC Moot, that's right on! If you check the Political forum's thread, "This makes for very interesting read..." whatever it's called, regarding the world banking system... The Federal Reserve which is and has been privately owned and operated...... it's a good read... and provides truth with bearing.

[hummalumma]

Is there a chance that this rail line may have a positive impact? Could the additional economic stimulus contribute to the Tibetan cause?

Perhaps once it is completed western tourists will have the opportunity to experience what is left of Tibetan culture.



...ARE YOU KIDDING ME? IF YOU CARE ONE IOTA, PERHAPS YOU SHOULD LEARN MORE ABOUT THE SITUATION THEN MAKE SILLY COMMENTARY. IF ONE MORNING YOU SHOULD WAKE UP AND FEEL VERY CONFIDENT, GO TELL YOUR HORSE STORY TO A TIBETAN IN YOUR CITY...OH YEAH, WEAR A SHIRT THAT SAYS "IGNORANCE IS BLISS".

[ericg]

The post did seem to completely miss the point and settle for it being so wrong like it doesn't stop, looking bereft of any real convictions on the matter. The right answer cannot ever be futile! In fact it's the only thing worth while that is... just right! There's so much more to it all, and it all matters, to put it simply. Milleson has been helpful and is trying to make a go of it... somehow.. in a world that's gone so mad it's left so many on the dark side of no-man's land, essentially.

I should have done this already.. maybe we can work on a letter if you haven't already, in SFT's stead. It won't arrive for T.D. Rinpoche's 3rd anniversary which was on the 7th, but will be in time for G.C. Nyima's (the 11th Panchen Lama) 16th B-day. Both have been abducted by the Chinese government and are being held against their will:

Dear Tenzin Delek Rinpoche,

Although I know you will not be permitted to see this for a corrupt, detestable, and oppressing Chinese government, I am very inspired by the many organizations that care and are doing everything they can for your plight. We are current and mindful of the existing tragedy on your side of the world. We are keeping pressure on the Chinese government as they have betrayed humanity, making it known that their government is not to be trusted and needs to be dealt with accordingly. My children's children will know of your peaceful ways and the horrifying plight of your people. We will never stop pursuing the Chinese government and all governments who oppress the citizens, squander the world's resources and that cause a degenerating effect and ill climate. You have ultimately won the war and your country's faith is a touchstone symbolizing a spirit kept true and good under such horrifying events. One day this will end and justice will prevail.


Dear Gedham Choekyi Nyima,

I am writing you from the United States of America to wish you a Happy 16th Birthday!!! I have been inspired by your people's spirit and peaceful ways, and by the many organizations that advocate your release and the liberation of Tibet. I pray this finds you well. We will not be deceived by such a corrupt government and will continue to fight for justice. Peace.

And I gotta thank Adam Y...!!!!
I'll work on it and get it sent.

[milleson]

...ARE YOU KIDDING ME? IF YOU CARE ONE IOTA, PERHAPS YOU SHOULD LEARN MORE ABOUT THE SITUATION THEN MAKE SILLY COMMENTARY. IF ONE MORNING YOU SHOULD WAKE UP AND FEEL VERY CONFIDENT, GO TELL YOUR HORSE STORY TO A TIBETAN IN YOUR CITY...OH YEAH, WEAR A SHIRT THAT SAYS "IGNORANCE IS BLISS".

I find it unfortunate that you responded so negatively to my comment.

Anyhow, I realized the other day that perhaps the Chinese invasion does indeed have a positive side. Without it, the Dalai Lama would not have been forced to leave Tibet. Would he have still traveled the globe spreading messages of both Buddhism and non-violence? Would the world even acknowledge or care about Tibetan Buddhism?

Yes, it is quite atrocious that the Chinese have committed countless crimes against Tibet culture. I am not denying that fact. Yes, I am deeply troubled by that. My horse analogy was not directed at you, Hummalumma, but at others who may wish to hear a different perspective on the issue. The railway's construction seems inevitable, as does the imminent opening the Tibetan copper mines. I honestly feel that the plight of Tibetan culture should be viewed in the most positive of terms. Is it not a Buddhist teaching, "I should be happy to have an enemy, for he assists me in my conduct of Awakening"? To me this is precisely what the Chinese have done, only on a much larger scale.

Hummalumma, I am sure you will continue to disagree with me; I have no problem with that. However, I do find it unkind for you to so harshly criticize my efforts, as we appear to be working towards a similar goal, that of spreading the word of the Tibetan plight and motivating others to take action.

[ericg]

Not to befoul your code of ethics...

Yes, the world would know....
See, I don't believe in, "The Bush administration's complex criminal and corrupt wrongdoings made me recognize what's good in life and keep me..., thankyou Bush...", or..."Thankyou Chinese government, for pissing me off and giving me the chance to turn it into motivation for what I know better..."???? What is that? Thankyou for making me hate it so much, I'll use my power to do good... NO, I am who I am... the way it goes is... always for the best practical common sense and we all should be light years ahead but for the Bush administration and the Chinese governments of the world... There are a million plus people (citizens) who should make the difference compared to the very small size in comparison to the governments...!

I mean fuck, don't you hate to say that?

You've never really responded to me but once... And not to be too personal... It's good to be positive... but not only to wrap around the ball of negativity. When will justice be inevitable do you think? Thought... intention... action.... Spindoctoring an existing wrong situation gets real old after... I'm not sayng go save the world milleson, but... go save the world. Really, the only right thinking here is that China gives Tibet their land back and pays for their inhumane activity... for the rest of their life. Anything else doesn't cut it. Yes, alot of corruption and wrought circumstances seem inevitable at this point, but no sense trying to make the situation ok that never will be, until... someone starts thinking differently.

I don't mean to be a pain in the ass..!

[hummalumma]

I find it unfortunate that you responded so negatively to my comment.

Anyhow, I realized the other day that perhaps the Chinese invasion does indeed have a positive side. Without it, the Dalai Lama would not have been forced to leave Tibet. Would he have still traveled the globe spreading messages of both Buddhism and non-violence? Would the world even acknowledge or care about Tibetan Buddhism?


... Once again, your ignorance shines through. I will give you an analogy and perhaps it will shed some light. If you were raped, how would you feel? Perhaps you would go on a crusade and tell others about your experience and help others cope with their feelings. Maybe you would try to find the attacker and bring them to justice. Or maybe, it would have been better if you had never been raped at all. The only difference in that analogy is, you would still be getting sexually assaulted year after year.
I hope you get the point.





Yes, it is quite atrocious that the Chinese have committed countless crimes against Tibet culture. I am not denying that fact. Yes, I am deeply troubled by that. My horse analogy was not directed at you, Hummalumma, but at others who may wish to hear a different perspective on the issue. The railway's construction seems inevitable, as does the imminent opening the Tibetan copper mines.


... If something is inevitable, do you simply accept it and look for the positive?
Tibetan land and culture is being raped and you want to give it a different slant? What country are you from?



I honestly feel that the plight of Tibetan culture should be viewed in the most positive of terms. Is it not a Buddhist teaching, "I should be happy to have an enemy, for he assists me in my conduct of Awakening"? To me this is precisely what the Chinese have done, only on a much larger scale.


...it must be nice for you to have the comfort of saying such things in the comfort of your home. Much larger scale? You have dumbed down the entire massacre of over one million Tibetans and 6,000 monasteries to a 'teaching'.





Hummalumma, I am sure you will continue to disagree with me; I have no problem with that. However, I do find it unkind for you to so harshly criticize my efforts, as we appear to be working towards a similar goal, that of spreading the word of the Tibetan plight and motivating others to take action.


... Our goals are NOT the same. Perhaps you should talk to a Tibetan and ask them if they find the Tibetan situation positive. Don't forget to wear your t-shirt.
Go watch What Remains of Us and get back to me. Otherwise, please refrain from what you believe is the right approach.

[milleson]

Thank you for your opinions and have a nice day.

[ericg]

Your welcome.
Thankyou.
You too...
;) :)

What I said was only in partial response to you... any more would not be keeping and open mind. I mean, it CAN be very hard to give the world all the thought in the world... but really it only takes the right thinking to care for and manifest one true thought. Sometimes gotta start from scratch and build the right momentum based on motivation, the right experiences, and virtues.... The majority have built their homes on sand claiming it's their plot, that only what they see counts, all the while they've only skimmed the surface and seen what they want... thereby creating static, disinformation, pollution... for everyone else. With no Dr. Kings, or any kind of real stand or symbol of truth and justice... There's only a few Senators I would even think to trust, though so many I thought were good, turned out to be turned out. Peace. Ok, well, before I get started... :D

[ericg]

In corroboration... sometimes when you lose you win, and when you win you lose.
Peace.