Question for both sexes.

[Mr_Complex]

Picture this, you're on a nightout and you see a girl in a mini-skirt. The skirt is fairly mini. What would your immediate impression of this girl?

[laurie_hammy]

She wants guys. :)

[Mr_Complex]

Okay.

Another scenario.

This girl wearing said mini-skirt is out with a group of girls. What would be the immediate impression of this group?

[Mcmac]

shes a stupid skank slut and ya'd treat her like a prostitute ;)

[Mr_Complex]

I know the answers anyway. I just want to know what the viewpoint is from females. As a guy, I think 'yes, she's single and up for it'.

[laurie_hammy]

shes a stupid skank slut and ya'd treat her like a prostitute ;)

Nice work. Was acting as the angry bad ass, now trying to act like an experienced man whore.

[Mcmac]

shut the fuck up

[laurie_hammy]

shut the fuck up

and there it is, the "angry" side of Mcmac.

[Mr_Complex]

What a waste.

[Tzar]

my first thoughts when i see a HOT girl in a mini skirt: she wants the cock and will probably get it by the end of the night. and i'd like to give to it. fuck knowing her afterwards.

my thoughts when i see a UGLY girl in a mini skirt: she wants the cock and won't get it unless someone has beer goggles.

[TonsOfFun]

Some girls like that are like a sign to me saying "you can fit 7 cocks inside me and I want it". Not very attractive at all.

But I have a fairly low opinion of women I don't know. An unfair opinion but that is my problem :)

[miss_bhaven]

Picture this, you're on a nightout and you see a girl in a mini-skirt. The skirt is fairly mini. What would your immediate impression of this girl?

Slut - obviously looking for attention. Nice perve though...that's if she's attractive! ;)

[Rancid_Beasties]

^ :eek: (y) I'd have to see how small this mini skirt is before I could make a judgement. As for the group, well I wouldnt assume they were all sluts judging by this one girl, but if they were all dressed like that well...

[miss_bhaven]

Okay.

Another scenario.

This girl wearing said mini-skirt is out with a group of girls. What would be the immediate impression of this group?

An entire group of attention seeking whores ;) ...Though, once again - nice to perve at... (if attractive)

[monkey]

i always wear mini skirts. cause i have little legs and mini skirts look pretty on me. never for the cock. i think thats diiiirty.

but dont judge a girl by the mini. judge by the attitude. yeaaaaaa.

[Mcmac]

and there it is, the "angry" side of Mcmac.

how do you know im being angry?

[QueenAdrock]

i always wear mini skirts. cause i have little legs and mini skirts look pretty on me. never for the cock. i think thats diiiirty.

but dont judge a girl by the mini. judge by the attitude. yeaaaaaa.

Me too. I think I'm pretty innocent-looking, so mini-skirts are more cute than anything else. I don't look like the kind of girl that screams for cock.

I do know what you mean though, there are some girls that are just asking for it. But they usually have Greek letters on their shirts, which is a MUCH easier way to tell if they want cock.

[jabumbo]

i usually judge by the amount of make up on their face

[BionicEye]

pretty girls don't need to wear a lot of make-up

[Chicka B]

Just 1 girl: Trying to look good so she can get attention from guys.

Group of girls: The girls is competing against eachother to see who guys like better.

[miss_bhaven]

I think it also matters on how the chiq holds herself...how she comes across...as to whether or not she can be classed a 'slut' in a mini-skirt.

[QueenAdrock]

I think it also makes a difference of what kind of miniskirt it is. I have one that is a skort. I <3 it because I can be as unladylike as I want, without fear of flashing anyone. baching (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v131/QueenAdrock1/Diana%20and%20Wayne/dianawynesmall.jpg)

[Mr_Complex]

Example. (http://www.riverisland.com/productdetails.jsp?kick=-1953188646&sid=87528152&bo_uid=1140&prodid=BX812&indexPos=0&lpguid=200205)

[monkey]

i wear skirts cause i like them better than shorts. and i have skirts like that one ^^. actually my favorite lazy day skirt is a short short denim skirt.

i always come off as a tomboy, even in skirts.

i like it like that. i guess im just always asking for dick, huh. :rolleyes:

[Tzar]

i guess im just always asking for dick, huh. :rolleyes:
yep

[TurdBerglar]

i don't get it when chicks dress like skanks but don't want the dick too.

[Mr_Complex]

i don't get it when chicks dress like skanks but don't want the dick too.

Ding ding ding.

[TurdBerglar]

the only reason guys dress up is to impress females and get laid

[Mr_Complex]

This is true. What can guys wear that would give them a similar representation as a woman wearing a mini-skirt?

Tight fitting shirt? Tight fitting trousers/jeans?

[TurdBerglar]

the whole no shirt thing is similar to the miniskirt



but basically guys just got to look like they have money by wearing stylish clothes.

[QueenAdrock]

Example. (http://www.riverisland.com/productdetails.jsp?kick=-1953188646&sid=87528152&bo_uid=1140&prodid=BX812&indexPos=0&lpguid=200205)


That's no shorter than shorts. Why are mini-skirts skanky, but shorts not?

[monkey]

i don't get it when chicks dress like skanks but don't want the dick too.

why is wearing a skirt skanky? if that's part of your style, why should anyone think that a short skirt is supposed to be anything but a short skirt? same as wearing a tank top, or a tshirt, or a sweatshirt, or even ass tight jeans.

i think you're confusing skanky girls with no style that wear short skirts to show off whatever with regular girls who pick and choose pieces as part of their style. cause it looks nice on them. a skanky girl will be a skanky girl whether she's wearing a skirt, jeans, a tunic or a sheath.

[TurdBerglar]

short shorts are skanky just not as much


skirts are skankier becuase there's easier access to the goods. isn't that the whole point of skirts being attractive?

[QueenAdrock]

Many skirts I've seen chicks wear have built-in shorts underneath.

I guess that's frustrating to men who want access to their so-called "easy goods".

[TurdBerglar]

why is wearing a skirt skanky? if that's part of your style, why should anyone think that a short skirt is supposed to be anything but a short skirt? same as wearing a tank top, or a tshirt, or a sweatshirt, or even ass tight jeans.

i think you're confusing skanky girls with no style that wear short skirts to show off whatever with regular girls who pick and choose pieces as part of their style. cause it looks nice on them. a skanky girl will be a skanky girl whether she's wearing a skirt, jeans, a tunic or a sheath.


there's only one reason to wear tight and revealing clothes....to advertise. that's skanky. there's better ways to advertise.

[Mr_Complex]

That's no shorter than shorts. Why are mini-skirts skanky, but shorts not?

Shorts? I'm picturing a German man wearing leiderhosen (sp?) here.

Not exactly the same intentions of a mini-skirt.

I think that, with a mini-skirt, the whole connotations of what a woman is when she wears one on a nightout comes into question.

I, personally, think that a woman has every right to wear what she wants to wear. A mini-skirt looks good on any woman that isn't trying to dress like a slut. (Low cut top, white stillettos etc)

[TurdBerglar]

Many skirts I've seen chicks wear have built-in shorts underneath.

I guess that's frustrating to men who want access to their so-called "easy goods".


those were just created to let females dress like skanks but let them feel less skanky becuase of the inner hidden shorts

[QueenAdrock]

I seriously think it also matters on how much class the chick has.

For example

this (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v131/QueenAdrock1/sluts.jpg)

Versus

this (https://www.salonbuilder.com/templates/new/images/stock/solid/plain/gen-woman-short-blonde.jpg)

[Mr_Complex]

Can only see the second pic but I'm guessing the first picture you linked was Courtney Love?

[QueenAdrock]

Fixed.

Not quite as cracked out as Courtney, but plenty as skanky.

[Knuckles]

Fixed.

Not quite as cracked out as Courtney, but plenty as skanky.
Is the brunette adrockmelanie? :D

[Beth]

i think women who wear micro minis are looking for any attention they can get; negative attention is better than none at all. they have to realize what kind of responses they're going to get. since all of you think she's out for cock, any guy looking to get laid is going to approach her.

as for mini skirts in general, it's about who you are and how you carry yourself. for example: paris hilton will never look classy no matter what type of skirt she wears.

[Lex Diamonds]

my first thoughts when i see a HOT girl in a mini skirt: she wants the cock and will probably get it by the end of the night. and i'd like to give to it. fuck knowing her afterwards.

my thoughts when i see a UGLY girl in a mini skirt: she wants the cock and won't get it unless someone has beer goggles.
I couldn't have put it better myself. (y)

[The Notorious LOL]

wow sounds like a bunch of 15 year olds in this thread.

when I see a girl in a mini skirt i usually think "hey look theres a girl in a mini skirt!"

I also do the same thing when I see a girl in a hooded sweatshirt, except mini skirt is replaced with hooded sweatshirt in the above phrasing.

[71kap]

i dont think you can judge just by the skirt - you have to look at the overall picture (hair - makeup - attitude) a girls attitude can say everything.

[sheesh]

i dont think you can judge just by the skirt - you have to look at the overall picture (hair - makeup - attitude) a girls attitude can say everything.

Yeah, attitude has got to be the only way Tori Spelling ever got a date. Oh yeah, and her daddy's money.

[Documad]

when I see a girl in a mini skirt i usually think "hey look theres a girl in a mini skirt!"

I also do the same thing when I see a girl in a hooded sweatshirt, except mini skirt is replaced with hooded sweatshirt in the above phrasing.
which is why you will always be successful with the ladies.

[enree erzweglle]

When I was in my 20s and early 30s, I wore tight/short skirts & dresses or somewhat-revealing clothes frequently. It didn't mean anything other than I liked the way I looked in those clothes.

I try to think that way when I see people dressed like that now...they're just enjoying themselves and are having a bit of fun.

However and regardless of what they're wearing, if they're drunk and are hanging all over people and are generally acting all Courtney Love, that makes me think that maybe they make a habit of not wanting to go home alone at night.

[zorra_chiflada]

if girls want to get some, they should try leaving more to the imagination.

[The Notorious LOL]

which is why you will always be successful with the ladies.



so true.

[Medellia]

Many skirts I've seen chicks wear have built-in shorts underneath.
My favorite skirt is like this. And even though it's a mini I've seen shorts far skankier. Make-up is certainly a better indication than clothing. Most of the time.

[discopants]

pretty girls don't need to wear a lot of make-up

Good point, I hate seein' a bird caked in make up. That shits weak.

Picture this, you're on a nightout and you see a girl in a mini-skirt. The skirt is fairly mini. What would your immediate impression of this girl?

It all depends on weight and inebriation level.

[Knuckles]

I could care less about what a woman wears but when a little girlis sporting this kind of attire... :(

It makes me want to wring her parents necks!

[laurie_hammy]

how do you know im being angry?

Because you never stop saying SLUT FUCK SLUT FUCK SLUT FUCK SLUT FUCK.

[miss_bhaven]

i dont think you can judge just by the skirt - you have to look at the overall picture (hair - makeup - attitude) a girls attitude can say everything.


Hmmm...good point ;)

[Rancid_Beasties]

Come to think of it...theres so many girls with short skirts at clubs nowadays that its less of a statement that a girl wants the cock and more of a going with the norm thing. I wonder whats going to be the next advancement in fashion that will replace mini-skirts as a signal for promiscuity.

[ms.peachy]

I love how it never occurs to guys that chicks might ever wear anything that isn't directly related to the degree to which they "want it".

[Tzar]

Come to think of it...theres so many girls with short skirts at clubs nowadays that its less of a statement that a girl wants the cock and more of a going with the norm thing.
yeah, that's right. girls who want the cock just get straight to the point and trade saliva right there and then. the last couple of times i've been out, one of my ex's happens to be at the clubs too - as soon as she sees me, she'll hook in with the closest guy.

she is pathetic.

[enree erzweglle]

I love how it never occurs to guys that chicks might ever wear anything that isn't directly related to the degree to which they "want it".
I know. I don't think I've ever dressed to signal to anyone anything like what people are reading into here. Same with makeup/hair.

I think a much more safe set of signals to observe is the person actions--what is a person doing with his/her body is probably what's going to clue you into that person's personality and intentions far more than anything else.

BTW, it seems to me that most people who go to clubs seem to want to hook up in some way or another--either for the night or for life. For that reason, clubs never appealed to me. The whole atmosphere seems very fake, forced, contrived.

[Rancid_Beasties]

I love how it never occurs to guys that chicks might ever wear anything that isn't directly related to the degree to which they "want it".
Okay, you make a good point, but you aren't the first person to point this out. I was reading an article on the hidden gender of the australian legal system the other day, and the way in which clothing and intoxication can effect the outcome of rape cases. Often, the way in which women see themselves when wearing a short skirt can be completely the opposite to the way in which men see them. For instance, on case was about an army party that had a beach theme, and the female officer who was raped was earlier mud wrestling in her bikini and also drinking alot. However, this does not change the fact that she was raped against her will. Yet, the courts believe that it does, even though she was raped while passed out. They came to the conclusion that despite the fact that everybody was drunk, and everybody was in bathers of one form or another, that this woman was obviously not of high moral character and could not be believed. Now if a fairly progressive legal system like that which we have in Australia can make value judgements and discriminate against women wearing short skirts, bikinis etc in such a way, then how do you expect the average male to completely stunt thoughts that are inherent not only in our biological but also our sociological context. I agree, we shouldnt be reading as much into it as we do, but theres some forms of clothing that are just obviously open for misinterpretation and perhaps it is for this reason that so often men view what may be simply a fashion statement as an invitation.

[enree erzweglle]

They [the Australian courts] came to the conclusion that despite the fact that everybody was drunk, and everybody was in bathers of one form or another, that this woman was obviously not of high moral character and could not be believed.

(!) (!) Amazing.

Now if a fairly progressive legal system like that which we have in Australia can make value judgements and discriminate against women wearing short skirts, bikinis etc in such a way, then how do you expect the average male to completely stunt thoughts that are inherent not only in our biological but also our sociological context.

Good point. I have no idea. Honestly, that ruling above stuns me.

[ms.peachy]

Well that case as you describe it is indeed stunning and I really have no further comment about it, because I don't know anything about it to have an informed opinion.

Mostly I was just noticing (yet again in my life) how funny most men are. They seem to be incapable of looking at any woman in a way other than how they personally relate to them, whereas women I think by and large can more easily see men within whatever role they are acting in at the moment, whether it has to do with them (the woman) personally or not. It's just an observation that has occurred to me on several occasions; this is only the latest example.

What I also find peculiar, and so sad, is the palpable undercurrent of hostility that is evident in many of the responses here, and of course this is just a microcosm of the larger world. The unspoken "how dare she". How dare a woman dress in a way that indicates she might enjoy being sexually desirable. How dare she present herself as desirable. Slut. Whore. Whatever happens to her, she deserves it. How dare she. Who does she think she is? What right does she have to be sexy, attractive, show some leg? Bitch.

Sad.

[miss_bhaven]

yeah, that's right. girls who want the cock just get straight to the point and trade saliva right there and then. the last couple of times i've been out, one of my ex's happens to be at the clubs too - as soon as she sees me, she'll hook in with the closest guy.

she is pathetic.


Tzar's ex = stupid whore! :mad:

[beastieangel01]

Picture this, you're on a nightout and you see a girl in a mini-skirt. The skirt is fairly mini. What would your immediate impression of this girl?

depends on the girl.

Mainly: if she has some super cottage cheese chunk going on and is wearing that I'd cringe a bit. If she was thin, athletic, or whatever the hell I'd at least be happy it didnt' gross me out.

Otherwise, "damn that's short" and that's about all I'd think.

[Qdrop]

wow sounds like a bunch of 15 year olds in this thread.

when I see a girl in a mini skirt i usually think "hey look theres a girl in a mini skirt!"

I also do the same thing when I see a girl in a hooded sweatshirt, except mini skirt is replaced with hooded sweatshirt in the above phrasing.

ha.
yeah, you're mr. fuckin progressive.

kiss some more feminist ass why dontcha....





the real deal is that, WHETHER WOMEN ADMIT IT OR NOT, they KNOW that men look at ever piece of clothing and make-up on thier bodies and judge them for it.
They KNOW that mini-skirts equate to greater sexual provocativeness.
that is why they wear it.

if one wants to argue whether that is acceptable or not, that is another debate altogether.

but this vague talk about women wearing miniskirts "just to look nice, not to be skanky.."
WHAT'S THE FUCKIN DIFFERANCE?!
anyway you want to verbally spin it, women are attempting to look attractive to men, or to gain envy of other women.
period.
don't pretend.
don't pretend that YOU wear skirts just to "look nice"...while that other girl wears it "cause she has low self esteem and is just trying to get guys to look at her"...
you're both the same.
you both want to guys to look at you.
you both want other girls to envy you in some way.
don't pretend you're all enlightened and above it all......

it's all perception: if you hate that girl, then she wears skirts to look skanky.
if you like that girl (or if YOU are the girl), she just wears them just to look nice and "what's the big deal?".

[mickill]

I try to present myself in a way that people would find attractive. That's pretty much human nature, to want people to find you attractive, isn't it? It doesn't mean that I'd have sex with you just because you like the way I look, though. I'm assuming it's the same for women.

[beastieangel01]

If I wear a mini-skirt, I wear it because when I tried it on I thought it looked nice.

And perhaps I THINK it looks nice on me because of the images that I am exposed to everyday via various media and what the general male population find attractive (which is something that girls are subjected to constantly) tell me that it looks nice. It could be conscious, or not.

However, in general, usually people wear the things they wear because they think it looks good on them. If they didn't care about how others saw it, they would probably be okay wearing trash bags everyday.

I guess my point is that NOT everyone wears something in particular because they are CONSCIOUSLY thinking about "oh is a guy/girl going to look at me and like it."

[little j]

Picture this, you're on a nightout and you see a girl in a mini-skirt. The skirt is fairly mini. What would your immediate impression of this girl?
gosh. isn't she cold?

[little j]

Okay.

Another scenario.

This girl wearing said mini-skirt is out with a group of girls. What would be the immediate impression of this group?
how come her friends let her be cold like that?

[little j]

i dont generally wear minis because i have a big ass and thighs and yeah. not cool plus my legs are super long so a mini on a regular girl would be super mini on me. woo hoo.

i generally wear jeans that look like they are pasted on and a really really low cut shirt when i go out. because it makes me feel sexy. and if i feel sexy i am sexy.

[zorra_chiflada]

ha.
yeah, you're mr. fuckin progressive.

kiss some more feminist ass why dontcha....





the real deal is that, WHETHER WOMEN ADMIT IT OR NOT, they KNOW that men look at ever piece of clothing and make-up on thier bodies and judge them for it.
They KNOW that mini-skirts equate to greater sexual provocativeness.
that is why they wear it.

if one wants to argue whether that is acceptable or not, that is another debate altogether.

but this vague talk about women wearing miniskirts "just to look nice, not to be skanky.."
WHAT'S THE FUCKIN DIFFERANCE?!
anyway you want to verbally spin it, women are attempting to look attractive to men, or to gain envy of other women.
period.
don't pretend.
don't pretend that YOU wear skirts just to "look nice"...while that other girl wears it "cause she has low self esteem and is just trying to get guys to look at her"...
you're both the same.
you both want to guys to look at you.
you both want other girls to envy you in some way.
don't pretend you're all enlightened and above it all......

it's all perception: if you hate that girl, then she wears skirts to look skanky.
if you like that girl (or if YOU are the girl), she just wears them just to look nice and "what's the big deal?".

(y)
see, i do agree with you on some things ;)
women dress in a sexual provocative way because they want to be seen as sexual objects, and NOT as human beings. and they will get treated that way. it's not the fault of the male gender, ("how dare they think of women like that...") that's how men work. women know it. a woman's sexuality is a weapon that is frequently abused.

[The Notorious LOL]

Im not kissing feminist ass, I generally dont think a girl is skanky based solely on a mini skirt though. Mini skirt, slutty low cut shirt, and drunk as fuck at the bar however means shes going to sit on the first available penis possible

[TurdBerglar]

is a mini skirt skanky compared to baggy sweatpants?

[Sarky Devotchka]

miniskirts aren't that big of a deal. if you got the legs, might as well show them off. a trashy girl is a trashy girl, no matter what she's wearing.

I think trying to dress sexy is more of a habit anyway. Obviously women want to be attractive, but they may not be aware of how revealing their clothes are. Sometimes I see pictures of myself in certain outfits and I'm like "jesus christ, my tits are practically falling out of my shirt!" It's not like I went "oh yeah, so many guys are gonna want to fuck me" and unbuttoned my shirt a little lower. Although I do like to say that we dress like sluts, because it's funny. but it's more like trying to dress in a semi-shocking fashiony way...err, I don't know.

I wore a black mini-dress (cut to just below me bum) to a holiday party with red tights and heels and I certainly was looking to get laid. so it depends.

although I think that men tend to read too much into what women wear. One time my college boyfriend and I were out on the town while it was raining and we saw a bunch of girls, some of whom were wearing white shirts. He was like, "oh, they planned that, they knew it was going to rain, they knew their shirts would get wet and see-through" and I was like, "uhh, okay, I seriously doubt that they formulated a plan to wear white shirts just to make guys excited".

[QueenAdrock]

anyway you want to verbally spin it, women are attempting to look attractive to men, or to gain envy of other women.
period.
you both want to guys to look at you.
you both want other girls to envy you in some way.
don't pretend you're all enlightened and above it all......

Hmm. I wonder what the reasoning is behind me wearing my miniskirts when I'm home alone, then. I must be waiting to walk by a mirror by accident so I can catch my eye and think "Wow, I want to fuck you" and go upstairs and masturbate. :rolleyes:

[Ace42X]

Hmm. I wonder what the reasoning is behind me wearing my miniskirts when I'm home alone, then.

Narcisistic lesbianism. Do you catch yourself staring in mirrors a lot?

[QueenAdrock]

Only if I'm feeling horny. :D

[BGirl]

Picture this, you're on a nightout and you see a girl in a mini-skirt. The skirt is fairly mini. What would your immediate impression of this girl?

without reading the rest of the thread, I'm going to say... not enough information

[Ace42X]

Only if I'm feeling horny. :D

With boobs like yours, I am surprised it is not more frequent.

[QueenAdrock]

How does everyone remember my tater tots? I've posted them up like, twice, and I don't even talk about them! :mad:

[zorra_chiflada]

How does everyone remember my tater tots? I've posted them up like, twice, and I don't even talk about them! :mad:

er, because you posted your breasts on the internet.
it's saved on everyone's hard drive

[QueenAdrock]

true :(

[zorra_chiflada]

true :(

and you've made ace42's drive...er...hard.

[Ace42X]

and you've made ace42's drive...er...hard.

On numerous occasions. Only temporarily mind, there are treatments.

[ms.peachy]

(y)
see, i do agree with you on some things ;)
women dress in a sexual provocative way because they want to be seen as sexual objects, and NOT as human beings. and they will get treated that way. it's not the fault of the male gender, ("how dare they think of women like that...") that's how men work. women know it. a woman's sexuality is a weapon that is frequently abused.
Zorra, I do get the feeling sometimes that you are not very comfortable with yourself sexually. Whenever the subject in any way turns to women and how they choose to express their sexuality, you seem to get really...I dunno, angry-like and a bit hostile, and make some really judgemental statements. I know you think of your viewpoints as 'feminist', but quite often they seem to me to be really rooted in an antiquated notions.

I'm not having a dig at you, just making an observation. Maybe it's just me. But I sometimes get the feeling that you are just not a very happy woman, or at least, a woman who is not happy about being a woman.

[Kid Presentable]

ha.
yeah, you're mr. fuckin progressive.

kiss some more feminist ass why dontcha....





the real deal is that, WHETHER WOMEN ADMIT IT OR NOT, they KNOW that men look at ever piece of clothing and make-up on thier bodies and judge them for it.
They KNOW that mini-skirts equate to greater sexual provocativeness.
that is why they wear it.

if one wants to argue whether that is acceptable or not, that is another debate altogether.

but this vague talk about women wearing miniskirts "just to look nice, not to be skanky.."
WHAT'S THE FUCKIN DIFFERANCE?!
anyway you want to verbally spin it, women are attempting to look attractive to men, or to gain envy of other women.
period.
don't pretend.
don't pretend that YOU wear skirts just to "look nice"...while that other girl wears it "cause she has low self esteem and is just trying to get guys to look at her"...
you're both the same.
you both want to guys to look at you.
you both want other girls to envy you in some way.
don't pretend you're all enlightened and above it all......

it's all perception: if you hate that girl, then she wears skirts to look skanky.
if you like that girl (or if YOU are the girl), she just wears them just to look nice and "what's the big deal?".


You fucking clown. Good post. Good, good post. (y)

[Qdrop]

Zorra, I do get the feeling sometimes that you are not very comfortable with yourself sexually. Whenever the subject in any way turns to women and how they choose to express their sexuality, you seem to get really...I dunno, angry-like and a bit hostile, and make some really judgemental statements. I know you think of your viewpoints as 'feminist', but quite often they seem to me to be really rooted in an antiquated notions.

I'm not having a dig at you, just making an observation. Maybe it's just me. But I sometimes get the feeling that you are just not a very happy woman, or at least, a woman who is not happy about being a woman.

not to speak for Zorra...
but that is so unfair.

to just assume that because she realizes that most women use thier bodies and their sexuality as weapons and assests (which is natural) and finds it unfortunate, does not make her insecure about her own sexuality.
some people (like myself) just have a natural aversion to those that use thier flesh rather then thier minds to succeed in life....

[avignon]

I wear mini skirts. I don't wear strappy tops or halters because they make me feel naked. Somehow I don't mind too much about showing my legs but I don't like to expose a lot of skin in other areas-like my belly or cleavage. It makes me feel uncomfortable. I think I feel this way because my mother always dressed me in shorts and skirts growing up. I have never associated my legs as being something sexual. To me it's like wearing a t shirt.

[ms.peachy]

not to speak for Zorra...
but that is so unfair.

to just assume that because she realizes that most women use thier bodies and their sexuality as weapons and assests (which is natural) and finds it unfortunate, does not make her insecure about her own sexuality.
some people (like myself) just have a natural aversion to those that use thier flesh rather then thier minds to succeed in life....
I am just saying how I perceive her to be much of the time. Quite often to me she comes across as being rather hostile to other women, especially to those who dare to express their sexuality outside of the narrow band of behaviour she has seemingly deemed to be acceptable. Although I know she thinks of herself as a feminist, it frequently occurs to me that she makes statements that strike me as rather negative towards women, particularly in any sexual context. When I see this repeated lashing out, it makes me question what is behind it.

And once again, it's not and 'either/or' choice, you know.

And, you are quite right, she does not need you to speak for her. So, don't.

[enree erzweglle]

You guys...if you have a deep instinct that all women use their bodies to get sex or attract a mate, I understand that a tiny bit because maybe you've been conditioned to think that way and maybe it's been reinforced over time. It's hard to break conditioning.

But maybe you ought to try to break it anyway.

Get out from under that sort of thinking and maybe pioneer a trend among your type that says with your actions and words that a person's skankiness is not determined by anything other than the long-term sets of actions that you observe directly.

[beastieangel01]

Hmm. I wonder what the reasoning is behind me wearing my miniskirts when I'm home alone, then. I must be waiting to walk by a mirror by accident so I can catch my eye and think "Wow, I want to fuck you" and go upstairs and masturbate. :rolleyes:

hahaha.

Yeah I wear one sometimes when I'm just home alone. Sometimes is hot as fuck and I don't want to wear a long skirt or pants.

[BGirl]

You guys...if you have a deep instinct that all women use their bodies to get sex or attract a mate, I understand that a tiny bit because maybe you've been conditioned to think that way and maybe it's been reinforced over time. It's hard to break conditioning.

But maybe you ought to try to break it anyway.

Get out from under that sort of thinking and maybe pioneer a trend among your type that says with your actions and words that a person's skankiness is not determined by anything other than the long-term sets of actions that you observe directly.

(y)

It doesn't seem to occur to some people that a woman might put on articles of clothing to please herself by her own sense of aesthetics. Or to be comfortable or whatever.

It's always assumed (particularly when it comes to things like this) that women do things to please or cause reactions in other people...

This is related to the male gaze thing we were discussing last year in the 'sit on my face' thread.

What makes you feel
And why you gotta be
Like you got the right
To look her up and down...

[Ace42X]

You guys...if you have a deep instinct that all women use their bodies to get sex or attract a mate, I understand that a tiny bit because maybe you've been conditioned to think that way and maybe it's been reinforced over time. It's hard to break conditioning.

Hah, it's because women behave that way. As much as you'd all like to pretend you are so far above that, you gals engage in totally innate and subconscious flirting behaviour all the time. Women undeniably use their bodies to attract a male - next time you are in a social setting, have a look around and see. Key things to look out for are "preening" (adjusting hair, straightening clothes, fiddling with buttons, etc) as well as chest-puffing and straightening posture.

Sorry to disappoint you feminists, but women's body-language and biological programming is every bit as transparent as men's.

[zorra_chiflada]

Zorra, I do get the feeling sometimes that you are not very comfortable with yourself sexually. Whenever the subject in any way turns to women and how they choose to express their sexuality, you seem to get really...I dunno, angry-like and a bit hostile, and make some really judgemental statements. I know you think of your viewpoints as 'feminist', but quite often they seem to me to be really rooted in an antiquated notions.

I'm not having a dig at you, just making an observation. Maybe it's just me. But I sometimes get the feeling that you are just not a very happy woman, or at least, a woman who is not happy about being a woman.

no, it's not that. i just don't like being told what i'm supposed to look like.
the whole "new feminism is about using your sexuality and being outward about it" i feel is a myth perpetuated by the media. and women fall for it. they seek acceptance my perfecting their appearance. i refuse to. and i do have a lot of criticism for women who tell me what i should look like and how to achieve it.

[enree erzweglle]

Hah, it's because women behave that way. As much as you'd all like to pretend you are so far above that, you gals engage in totally innate and subconscious flirting behaviour all the time. Women undeniably use their bodies to attract a male - next time you are in a social setting, have a look around and see. Key things to look out for are "preening" (adjusting hair, straightening clothes, fiddling with buttons, etc) as well as chest-puffing and straightening posture.

Sorry to disappoint you feminists, but women's body-language and biological programming is every bit as transparent as men's.I don't deny that some women do what you're suggesting. Not all women do, though. I don't do it for anyone but myself an I know that that's for real because I'm in my own head. Last I checked, it was single occupancy in there.

[Ace42X]

I don't do it for anyone but myself an I know that that's for real because I'm in my own head. Last I checked, it was single occupancy in there.

Heh, the idea that you can be aware (conscious) of your *sub*-conscious amuses me.

In other news:

http://www.theonion.com/content/node/40998

[ms.peachy]

Can anyone please explain to me why it's "bad" for women to be sexy? Or how somehow a woman being sensual means she can't also be intelligent? I'm still not clear on this.

Maybe it's because I wear miniskirts, am stupid and just 'want it' all the time.

[ms.peachy]

no, it's not that. i just don't like being told what i'm supposed to look like.
the whole "new feminism is about using your sexuality and being outward about it" i feel is a myth perpetuated by the media. and women fall for it. they seek acceptance my perfecting their appearance. i refuse to. and i do have a lot of criticism for women who tell me what i should look like and how to achieve it.
See, I don't get that it's about 'perfecting' anyone's appearance.

I just feel that often you are extremely critical of any woman who makes choices that are different to the ones you would make for yourself, and to me, having my (or any other woman's) sexuality/behaviour defined by another woman's definition of what's OK for me to do and what's not, is just as bad as having it defined by any man's.

[boys_beastie]

i dont really, but if along with the skirt they're wearing a schott hoodie, a nike TN cap, those big furry space-boots and lots of poorly put on foundation and eye liner then i tend to make an assuption.

[Rancid_Beasties]

Good point. I have no idea. Honestly, that ruling above stuns me.
If you actually wanna read the article I'm talking about its Alison Young, "The Waste land of the law: The wordless song of the rape victim", from the the Melbourne University Law review vol 22. Its quite a confronting article. In fact, in the case I mentioned not only did they use the clothing to discredit the victim, but they also used the fact that she was drinking that night in a peculiar way. They managed to use the fact that she was drinking, and was a regular social drinker to descredit her, but at the same time used the fact that she wasn't "blind drunk" to prove that she wasn't too drunk to consent. It may be confronting, but such a view that clothing and drinking choices things can be used to discredit women, and put them in danger is enshrined in (at least Australian) law. This is a quote from a Melbourne County Court Judge:
"A woman who dresses in a particularly noticable way who goes to particular types of functions is taking a risk. I don't have a daughter, but if my daughter came up to me on a Saturday night and said that she was going to the pub in singlet and shorts (ie like the short shorts you guys were talking about).... I'd be telling her not to go like that because it would be misconstrued. There's a big risk with alcohol, seeing a woman dressed like that, that people would misinterpret what that means. It doesn't mean that a woman dressed like that is inviting to be attacked" but it carries with it an increased risk. Now whether or not you believe it conveys a message in Australia does not really matter legally, because the courts do.

[enree erzweglle]

Heh, the idea that you can be aware (conscious) of your *sub*-conscious amuses me.I thought we were talking about choices that women make when they dress and what those choices imply (or what a lot of guys seem to think those choices imply).

My conscious mind directs what I wear, yes; that's what I was referring to in my earlier posts.

[Kid Presentable]

I think this argument gets muddled too quickly.

Really, it's about people being unwilling to accept that they do things for reasons other than what they think.

Like we choose our attire based on what makes us feel good, although it may also hold the promise of gratification at the hands(or other bits) of others.

We have built ourselves up to be the pinnacle of creation, in our own collective mind, and as such are very reluctant to accept the base instinct that drives us.

I see a girl in a miniskirt, I think a million things.

'It's cold'

'I'm horny'

'I wish I were playing playstation'

'What colour are her knickers?'

'I like chips'

I don't think any less or more of the girl for dressing as such, and quickly dissolve most memory of her from my mind.

As long as I'm not sharing any of my less desirable thoughts, then I suppose she'll just continue to wear the miniskirt because it makes her feel good.

I am a pig. But hey, what are you gonna do?

[zorra_chiflada]

See, I don't get that it's about 'perfecting' anyone's appearance.

I just feel that often you are extremely critical of any woman who makes choices that are different to the ones you would make for yourself, and to me, having my (or any other woman's) sexuality/behaviour defined by another woman's definition of what's OK for me to do and what's not, is just as bad as having it defined by any man's.


this thread isn't about what's "good" and what's "bad," it's about what you would think if you saw a woman wearing a miniskirt.
when it comes to some things, i am a very conservative person.

i noticed someone said (i believe it was a female) that if the chicks "ugly and fat" that's she's disgusted, but if she's "thin and hot" then it's good.
doesn't it bother you that if you're not gorgeous, have perfect breasts and a perfect arse, and if you don't put yourself on display, you might as well me invisible? that's how i feel all the fucking time. i feel it sometimes here on this message board. and i hate people that make me feel like that. why should i praise those that keep the negative sterotypes going, those who encourage males to see all women as sex objects? i do not want to be judged by those standards, but i am, and all women will be.

to be honest with you, being a female hasn't been proven to be the most wonderful thing for me, with eating disorders, sexual assault and insults. i'm trying to make it better

[Ace42X]

I thought we were talking about choices that women make when they dress and what those choices imply (or what a lot of guys seem to think those choices imply).

My conscious mind directs what I wear, yes; that's what I was referring to in my earlier posts.

Your conscious mind dictates what you choose out of a wardrobe selected by sub-conscious preferences.

As Tom Stoppard put it: Things we know about are influenced by things we know little about, which in turn are influenced by things about which we know nothing at all.

[Documad]

I don't deny that some women do what you're suggesting. Not all women do, though. I don't do it for anyone but myself an I know that that's for real because I'm in my own head. Last I checked, it was single occupancy in there.
Perfect answer.


Guys, and especially younger guys, are going to think what they're going to think, but if you try to think outside the box a little, it will benefit you long term. I'm not denying there are skanky women on the make, but it's about a lot more than clothes.

This reminds me of an episode of Designing Women. Do you get that sometimes groups of women go out to listen to live music and/or dance with no interest in men (either because they're married, in a serious relationship, not in the mood, or gay)?

[Documad]

This is a quote from a Melbourne County Court Judge:
"A woman who dresses in a particularly noticable way who goes to particular types of functions is taking a risk. I don't have a daughter, but if my daughter came up to me on a Saturday night and said that she was going to the pub in singlet and shorts (ie like the short shorts you guys were talking about).... I'd be telling her not to go like that because it would be misconstrued. There's a big risk with alcohol, seeing a woman dressed like that, that people would misinterpret what that means. It doesn't mean that a woman dressed like that is inviting to be attacked" but it carries with it an increased risk. Now whether or not you believe it conveys a message in Australia does not really matter legally, because the courts do.
This sounds like something that could have been written in the US in the early 1980s. Since then, there have been changes in the law, in education of the public at large, etc., which make that viewpoint a lot less prevalent.

It's still a factor though. And interestingly, when I worked in criminal courts, I noticed that male jurors (especially older ones) were way more understanding of a rape victim's choices than female jurors (who seemed to think "I wouldn't have done that").