asking for letters of recommendation

[Bob]

ok, i'm applying to law school soon, and i need to ask for letters of rec from my professors. i'm guaranteed to get a good one from my employer, so i really only need one more, and it's got to be from a prof, most schools i look at require at least two.

i've never done this before (i managed to get into uconn without any, somehow), how do i go about it? do professors write a lot of these, or is it a unique, individual, personal thing every time it happens? the semester ended a week ago, so i have to do it through email. how exactly should i word my request? i feel so awkward. I have three professors i'm going to ask, i've taken two classes with most, and i've received good grades from all of them, though i never really spoke up in class much or stood out. the two that i've had two classes with seemed to remember me in the second class though, so that's got to be a good sign. i hope at least ONE of them will be willing to write one.

anyway, any tips? what do i do? i have about an hour, because i don't have internet access at home, help, quick

[abcdefz]

I'd do it in person or at least by phone. You're asking for a professional courtesy; be professional.



(y)

[Nuzzolese]

Professors do this all the time, it's part of their job to write letters of recommendation, but it's best if they are more personal. Look in a few books or online for examples and advice about this. Also, send them a preaddressed, stamped envelope for them to mail their recommendation letter in. And after you ask them to do it, follow up in a couple of weeks to make sure they sent one. If one of the professors was your guidance counselor ask that one, or one whom you took classes from more than once, or just one you think would remember you.

[Bob]

well, like i said, the semester ended a week ago so that's not really an option, since i don't really know where they live. as awkward as this is, it would be even wierder if i just kind of showed up at their houses. i guess i could do it at the beginning of next semester but that would be cutting it kind of close. the semester begins jan. 17th, most schools' deadlines are march 1st, and they accept on a rolling basis, so the sooner the better. I figure, give them a month or so to write it and well, that's getting pretty close.

i think i'm allowed to send in the applications first and have the letters follow, maybe that would take care of the rolling admissions problem? i don't know. i get so nervous about these kinds of things

[Nuzzolese]

I would think just ask the one who you think has the best opinion of you, no matter what. And in your request, mention some specific reasons you are asking them to do this - like say "I really enjoyed that project on Afganistan that we all worked on in your modern warfare class because it was the first time I had to think about the US from an outsider's perspective. I learned so much working on that project alone. The challenges you gave us, about thinking objectively like that, are big reasons I decided I want to become a lawyer" or whatever. Mention specifics because it will remind them of specific things they can mention about you in their rec letter.

[Nuzzolese]

i think i'm allowed to send in the applications first and have the letters follow, maybe that would take care of the rolling admissions problem? i don't know. i get so nervous about these kinds of things

Oh totally. They will keep a file on you and hold everything for a time until all of your appplication materials arrive. They understand that you can't send everything in one package, that rec letters can take some time. Does the letter from the professor have to be sent through the mail or can it be email? I only suggest the preaddressed stamped envelope because it would make it so much easier for them to send one, and it would be polite. Can you email them and ask them for an address to send it? Can you send it to their office at UCONN? Can you call UCONN and ask for their home address? If you do that, if you send it to their homes, I'd email ahead of time to notify them that it's coming. You can always send both a brief email request and a written request.

[Nuzzolese]

I don't think waiting on the rec letters would take care of the rolling admissions thing because you won't be admitted or even considered until your application is complete, including letters of recommendation. But that's a general rule and some schools can make exceptions if you call and ask and if you let them know that a letter is certainly on the way.

You have no reason to feel awkward asking for this or calling UCONN or your law schools with questions and requests. As long as you are polite and to the point, there's no reason to be hesitant or worried. This is so standard. What do you think professors do if not help further education for their students? They would LOVE it if one of their students went on to grad school and admired them enough to pick them out of all their professors as someone to request a letter from.

[Bob]

well, law school admissions are handled through the LSAC (law school admissions council), which has a website. i looked into it, apparently, you go to lsac.org, specify who your recommenders are, then you print out some form from the website and send it to the recommenders. i'm not sure if they do it electronically or whatever from there, but that seems to be what i'm meant to do. letters get sent to the LSAC and then they get sent to the schools from there. i can even find applications for every ABA approved law school in the country from the LSAC website it's actually kind of cool.

i'm not sure which professor in particular would have the best chance of doing it. there's one that i got to know better than the rest, one who gave me the best grades, and the other one taught a philosophy of law class (seems appropriate!) and he's the only one whose class i showed up to 100% of the time (i have sleeping issues), but he's the one i've only had one class with so far (though i'll be taking another one next semester). I figure there's no harm in asking all three though, if they say no, they say no. hopefully one will say yes.

[Bob]

You have no reason to feel awkward asking for this or calling UCONN or your law schools with questions and requests. As long as you are polite and to the point, there's no reason to be hesitant or worried. This is so standard. What do you think professors do if not help further education for their students? They would LOVE it if one of their students went on to grad school and admired them enough to pick them out of all their professors as someone to request a letter from.

my main concern i guess is whether or not it's totally inappropriate to do this through email, i'd really prefer that way the best because i'm neurotic about phones. maybe a written/typed letter would be more appropriate? how should i phrase it? oh i am so not good at these things.

i looked around on google for tips, most of them seem to be about letters of recommendation for employment, which i think would be a little more complicated than letters for admission to schools, because i'm guessing the school ones are a little more...i don't know, common.

[Nuzzolese]

There are probably books about getting into law school that list ways to ask professors for recommendation letters. Do you know anyone in law school? Can you ask a college admissions office for suggestions?

I don't think it's inappropriate to do this through email, especially if you also send something in the mail. And written I think is best, more formal, you get to mention specific things to politely suggest some things they can write in your letters. I would suggest asking the prof who got to know you best, but yeah there's no harm in asking all 3, and you would know best. I never went to law school, I don't know about getting in. Don't worry so much about the philosophy of law prof. I mean, you'd like them to think you showed up to all of your classes. And they want people who are well-rounded with a wide range of education and interests. They know you're interested in law, otherwise you wouldn't be applying.

[Bob]

haha oh god this is terrible. i'm looking at tips online and these are the kinds of things i'm consistently finding:

3. Ask personally

When asking someone to write you a letter of rec, don't simply send an email or leave a voicemail message. It's to your advantage to ask the person face-to-face; not only does this allow you to clarify any doubts about the request, it automatically conveys to the recommendation writer just how important this letter is to you.

College and Graduate School Applicants: Don't wait until the last minute. Instructors are invariably flooded with recommendation requests at the end of the semester (as well as near application deadlines), and you don't want your letter to end up just one more item in a long To Do list.

crap crap crap...well it's not like i have much choice, i can't turn back time.

i don't know though, i'm still kind of encouraged, because one of my professors mentioned in class about how a student from one of his classes three years ago asked him for a letter recently, so he (the prof) had to go and dig up his old essays and stuff to consider it, he didn't immediately dismiss it or anything. of course, that student probably asked in person, and brought candy or something, that snot nosed sycophantic prick...well, i can try.

[Nuzzolese]

Leave the request buried inside a chocolate peppermint cake on the professor's doorstep, with a picture of you airbrushed into the frosting.

[Lipper]

do it in person or by phone. And ask the prof. who knows you the best. You have good grades; ur applying to law school. Admissions Committees dont give a crap about law classes prior to law school either. The whole thing about letters of rec. is they want to see a side of you that cant be put on paper with credentials, classes, etc. Everyone has good grades, and the law class means nothing.

Yo, if u have any other questions about the whole application process, LSAC, or just about law school in general, message me. I'm a 2L at albany law school.

[ToucanSpam]

Bob, are there any profs you are on really good terms with? If you feel comfortable enough, you can ask them. Just get one of them to write it up.

[Bob]

do it in person or by phone. And ask the prof. who knows you the best. You have good grades; ur applying to law school. Admissions Committees dont give a crap about law classes prior to law school either. The whole thing about letters of rec. is they want to see a side of you that cant be put on paper with credentials, classes, etc. Everyone has good grades, and the law class means nothing.



yeah, that's a good point. i have a 163 LSAT score and a 3.345 GPA (as close to the middle of 3.3 and 3.4 as you can get without being able to round up, goddamnit), so i'm hoping that will be a good foundation, hopefully i can at least get into a crappy law school (and maybe get a little bit of that sweet merit-based financial aid action).

i'm looking around though, and i'm DEFINITELY getting the vibe that it's very bad form to do this through email, which kind of blows. hmm. maybe if i sent them emails to set up an appointment to meet in person to make the request, or something. d'oh, d'oh, d'oh

january is going to be a very hectic month for me, i think.

[Freebasser]

Here Bob, you may use this as a reference...


Bob Bobson is a brilliant man who has come up with many well-thought-out, practical ideas, and is ensuring the financial future of this company for years to come. Oh, and his personal hygiene is beyond reproach.

A Teacher
The Institute for Wonderfully Gifted People

[marsdaddy]

Do it in person, once next semester starts. Or freak out your prof and look up their info on google and call them Xmas eve in a panic.

Profs do this all the time and I bet you'll be pleasantly surprised at how open they'll be to this.

[Nuzzolese]

maybe if i sent them emails to set up an appointment to meet in person to make the request


You are so smart!

[Lipper]

i'm looking around though, and i'm DEFINITELY getting the vibe that it's very bad form to do this through email, which kind of blows. hmm. maybe if i sent them emails to set up an appointment to meet in person to make the request, or something. d'oh, d'oh, d'oh

yeah, thats a good idea. a lot of times, profs want a resume and some other info about extracurriculars, working history, etc. While you could just email this info also, it could be a good excuse to make an appt.

A 163 LSAT is a great score (I got a 150, hence why i am at albany law). Good Luck!

[Bob]

yeah, thats a good idea. a lot of times, profs want a resume and some other info about extracurriculars, working history, etc. While you could just email this info also, it could be a good excuse to make an appt.

A 163 LSAT is a great score (I got a 150, hence why i am at albany law). Good Luck!

yeah, i'm looking around and it seems like there's a list of shit to send with my request, like;

# An unofficial transcript.
# A personal resume, including a clear statement of your intent to go to law school.
# A list of courses you have taken with the reference. Indicate what grades you made and any outstanding work you did for the class (copies of term papers, essays, tests, etc. are helpful).
# Relevant forms provided by the law schools. If the law school provides a form, there will be a place on the form for you to indicate whether you waive the right to have access to your file. Admissions officers may discount letters where the student has not signed the waiver.
# A stamped envelope addressed to the law school. While I recommend strongly the reference send this recommendation on their letterhead stationary, you should provide the envelope as a courtesy.

i had no idea! i was thiiiiiiis close to sending an email just saying "hello professor x, i was a student in your such and such class and i like your beard, anyway could you write me a letter please, thanks bye"

well, it was a little more formal than that but that's more or less the gist of it. oh boy, i'm more boned than i thought.

[voltanapricot]

ok, i'm applying to law school soon, and i need to ask for letters of rec from my professors. i'm guaranteed to get a good one from my employer, so i really only need one more, and it's got to be from a prof, most schools i look at require at least two.

i've never done this before (i managed to get into uconn without any, somehow), how do i go about it? do professors write a lot of these, or is it a unique, individual, personal thing every time it happens? the semester ended a week ago, so i have to do it through email. how exactly should i word my request? i feel so awkward. I have three professors i'm going to ask, i've taken two classes with most, and i've received good grades from all of them, though i never really spoke up in class much or stood out.
I went through a similar process a few months ago and I was crapping it because like you I felt I never really stood out and I'm very quiet. But apparantly it doesn't matter much, your grades reflect your commitment and ability. It's all ace in the end.

Don't waffle in the e-mail and just ask straight out what you want from them. They're experienced so don't worry about it too much.

[marsdaddy]

You are so smart!Then why is he going to law school? 80% of law school graduates do not practice law.

[Bob]

yeah, i'm thinking i'm going to send an email saying "hi, i'm applying to law school and i'd like to request a letter of recommendation if you're comfortable with it, would you like to set up an appointment to discuss it, either in person or by phone? sorry for the late notice and the email etc etc", but i'm still nervous about the whole thing. hell, i haven't even finalized my list of which schools i'm applying to yet. i should do that before i ask, shouldn't i? i'm going to do that first, screw this, i can put it off a little longer, there we go.

would it be too pathetic if i apologized for sending an email instead of asking during the semester, or doing it so late, or being so unprepared with my initial request, etc. etc.? i don't want to sound pathetic.

[Nuzzolese]

Then why is he going to law school? 80% of law school graduates do not practice law.

What does that have to do with being smart? A law school education can do so much for you anyway. People change their minds. Can you do a little bit more research about that 80% please and let me know what you find?

[voltanapricot]

would it be too pathetic if i apologized for sending an email instead of asking during the semester, or doing it so late, or being so unprepared with my initial request, etc. etc.? i don't want to sound pathetic.

How late is the notice? Are you applying in the new year? End of January? I wouldn't apologize just yet, maybe an "I appreciate that very much" in person maybe, once it's done. Where you asked to set up the appointment makes you sound rather conscientious. (y)

[Lipper]

80% of law school graduates do not practice law.

that is the fuckin dumbest statement.

[befsquire]

i always see things far too late to be of any real help.

i chose a professor who i knew adored me to write my letter of recommendation. he knew me very well, and when i called his judicial assistant to ask about making an appointment to ask about a letter of recommendation, she said he had already told her if i called, then my letter was to go on his priority list. he chose to write something that showed he personally knew me, so that it didn't sound like someone wrote a letter version of a resume. i don't think it was the fact he was a judge or that he wrote the letter on his judicial letterhead that influenced anyone, i think it was the fact you could tell he knew me and knew i was dedicated to doing whatever it took when it came to school.

when the time came for me to pick someone to swear me into the bar, i chose him. i've now had one trial in front of him, and one trial that almost went but then got dropped. i've also argued a few motions in front of him. the prosecutors get pissed when he sits in (he's a civil judge, not criminal), but he jokes with me and asks all sorts of personal questions and tells me stories, and it's quite obvious i'm a favorite; they always think he's going to rule in my favor.

[marsdaddy]

What does that have to do with being smart? A law school education can do so much for you anyway. People change their minds. Can you do a little bit more research about that 80% please and let me know what you find?It really has little to do with being smart. Actually, his LSATs demonstrate his intelligence.

Sorry, don't have time to do research -- to busy paying of student loans. Maybe you could do SOMETHING useful at B&N?

that is the fuckin dumbest statement.Eloquent, I see.
they always think he's going to rule in my favor.Does he?

[befsquire]

one time he overruled my objection, but then as soon as the prosecutor asked her question, he sustained my objection.

but truly, everything should have gone in my favor, so it isn't like his rulings are wrong.

[Lipper]

Eloquent, I see.


sometimes eloquence masks the true nature of a statement. I wanted to convey utter disgust with that statement. I think I conveyed my point, perhaps bluntly, although if i chose to refrain from using a profane word, the true essence of my message would have been damaged.

[milleson]

This time last year I had the same problem with asking for letters of recommendation. It was between semesters and all. I ended up sending an email inquiring when my professors would be in their officeseses. I dropped by at a convenient time and asked in person. (2 out of the 3 were impressed that I made such an effort to ask in person.)

[alexandra]

good luck, Bob. (y)

[Nuzzolese]

It really has little to do with being smart. Actually, his LSATs demonstrate his intelligence.

Sorry, don't have time to do research -- to busy paying of student loans. Maybe you could do SOMETHING useful at B&N?


WHAT are you talking about? IT has little to do with being smart? What has little to do with being smart? Going to law school? All I meant was that he was so smart to think of emailing his prof to set up a face-to-face meeting. I don't think there's anything stupid about him going to law school just because of some statistic you pulled from someplace. Oh and B&N is a book store. If you want to do research I'd suggest the library where they have more reference materials than copies of bestsellers. You're an asshole snob. Merry Christmas.

[adam_f]

Nuzzo's funny.

[Documad]

Golly, I can't remember who did my letters of recommendation. I'm sure I never asked a professor.

If I were doing it all over again, I would want to know what might impress the individual law school. Before asking a professor for a letter of recommendation, I'd have an idea where I want to go to school and why I want to go to law school. If I were the professor, I'd be asking you about that before I agreed to spend any time doing something for you. Make something up even if it's not the real reason. The person writing the recommendation is more likely to want to help if she thinks she's helping you get something you want that's right for you.

People ask me for recommendations sometimes and I do a much better job if I feel that it's something they want and I have an idea what I should play up. I'm always honest, but if helps me remember aspects of their personality and past performance and I can highlight the best stuff. I've got to do one for law school for a friend's daughter and she's just wonderful, but I wish she wasn't going to law school yet. She's so wonderful I want her to be more than a lawyer. :o

Also, is there anyone other than work or school who might do one? I have no idea how any of this plays at an actual school looking at the letters and whether they matter at all, but it would seem like the ones professors send are pretty blah unless the professor is really well known or he says something strikingly awesome about you. It might stand out to have something different. Of course, the letters are probably just something you have to do to complete your application so maybe they don't matter.

I guess a lot depends on where you're applying. I only had one real choice for a law school and it was so crap that they took me based on my LSAT score alone--they didn't even have my college transcript, etc. yet. :rolleyes:

[Documad]

I don't get what the bickering was about, and why the law student got mad, but it's true that loads of people who get law degrees don't practice law. Most of the people I knew in school don't practice. Many never did and many hated being lawyers and left. Some are perfectly happy in legal publishing or examining contracts at corporations or working at giant government agencies.

[marsdaddy]

You're an asshole snob. Merry Christmas.I must be the only one around here who wouldn't hold your hair back while you puked. Hurts, huh?

Yes, I'm the asshole and the snob.

You'd better watch out, you'd better not cry, you better not pout...

[befsquire]

i know several people who aren't going to be practicing law because they can't pass the bar. i know one who got her law degree just because she wanted another degree and thought that maybe she might actually want to do law one day. she just took a job that is not law related.

i would say that at least 50% of my graduating class was not going to be practicing law.

[Bob]

that's so wierd, because in the pamphlets that law schools send me, they list all these statistics about what their graduates go on to do. i haven't actually read them but the impression that i get is that a lot of them do go on to practice law. most of them seem to brag about 90%+ employment rates, i don't know, i just assumed.

anyway yeah, i haven't asked yet. i was going to friday evening, but after looking into it i figured out that i clearly wasn't quite ready to ask yet since i didn't even know which law schools i was going to apply to yet, so i'd take the weekend to sort myself out a little. now it's tuesday evening and i'm still not totally ready, haha :(

i think i'm just going to bite the bullet and send the emails. i'll ask about the letters in the emails, and offer to meet in person or talk over the phone or something as well, but i'll ask in the emails, i think that's probably not too offensive. i'll figure it out damnit. i only need one more (i've got a shining one from my employer in the bag), and really they're only needed for the sake of completing the applications, i have a 3.3 GPA and a 163 LSAT, it'd be a damn shame if the lack of a letter of recommendation is what keeps me from getting accepted. i figure as long as the letters aren't flat out derogatorry, they should be ok. i just need to have a minimum of two as a requirement. unfortunately i can't think of anyone else to get them from.

[Bob]

ok, this is the email my profs are going to get (don't tell them they're getting the same exact thing ok, i want them to think it's personal), let me know what you think (i know it probably doesn't matter what you think but i get so nervous over these kinds of things and i'd love to have some other opinions, plus it gives me an excuse to hesitate).

Dear Professor ___:

I will be applying to law school in the coming months and I am in need of a letter of recommendation. Having enjoyed and profitted from the classes that I have taken with you, I would be honored to have one from you if you think that you would be comfortable writing one. I realize that these requests are generally done in person or over the phone, not through email (and usually much sooner as well), I apologize profusely for that, but the semester being over, I'm not sure how else to get in contact with you. If you would like to discuss the matter in person or over the phone, I'd be glad to make an appointment to meet with you, my contact information is below. Or if you do not feel comfortable writing one, that's certainly your prerogative and I understand completely.

I appreciate that you are very busy and your time is quite valuable, so I'm very grateful for any consideration that you decide to give to the matter. If you do decide that you would be willing to write one, let me know what information I need to give you, as I'm not terribly familiar with how this process works (as evidenced by the time and manner of my request, sorry again). I know there's a form I need to give you from the LSAC, but I figured I should get your consent before I bother you with that.

At any rate, thank you for the consideration, and don't hesitate to contact me, I'm more than willing to make an appointment to meet in person if you feel it is necessary.

Sincerely,
Bob ____

Cell phone number
Work Phone
Home Phone


too much grovelling? i'm afraid there might be too much but it's kind of awkward to do this through email at all so i feel that a little grovelling is necessary.