Racism in the NFL?

[Qdrop]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/michael_silver/01/20/friday/index.html

^read and give your input....

[cj hood]

hiring a coach cuz he's black is just as bad as not hiring him cuz he's black!

[synch]

I think this is about hiring a white guy who isn't as qualified as many black guys who were up for the position, not about hiring an equally or less qualified black guy instead of a white guy.

[jabumbo]

a lot of teams have guys allready in mind when they fire their head coaches, so the period is short because they interview their top candidate first and if they take the job, more power them.

i don't think it should be made such a big deal. the fact is, there are more white guys who are coaching in general, and just because some guy has a better resume, doesn't mean he is going to get the job just for that reason.

most of the time they don't consider who they actually did hire, and why. usually when a coordinater gets put into the head coaching spot, they are picked becuase of the style that they have, which is something the team obviously likes about that person

[Extra Cheese]

racism in football? SHOCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Echewta]

Why aren't there women coaches? Asian? blah blah...

[Extra Cheese]

but I think maybe this is being blown out a bit.

maybe it isnt racism but its hard to find reasons other than racism as to why there arent more black coaches.

[Extra Cheese]

Why aren't there women coaches? Asian? blah blah...

how many qualified women coaches are there in the NFL? and how many qualified asians?????

[hpdrifter]

Does anyone wonder why there aren't more black quarterbacks?

[Qdrop]

Does anyone wonder why there aren't more black quarterbacks?

there's a shitload of black QB's now....what are you talking about?

fuck, jacksonville has ALL black QB's (3)...no white ones.
the Jaguars are racist.

Black QB's (starters): Daunte Caulpepper- vikings. aaron brooks- Saintns. D. Mcnabb- eagles. B. Leftwich-jaguars. Steve McNair- Titans. M.Vick-Falcons

6 pro bowl or near pro-bowl QB's ...and that's just the starters...

and you have loads of black QB's in college coming into drafts every year...
vince young...

shit, teams are far too concerned with winning and saving thier jobs to allow racist attitudes to allow a great black QB to ride the pine or not get drafted.

[Qdrop]

maybe it isnt racism but its hard to find reasons other than racism as to why there arent more black coaches.

i think it's just basic statistics at this point.

there are just more white personel in all coaching ranks, period. so more white coaches will be promoted, etc...just out of statistic probability.

when there's money to be made....and winning is literally everything....
teams can't AFFORD to let racist attitudes get in the way of putting a good team together...
look at how many coaches got fired this year (ALL white coaches who got fired, btw...no black ones...hmmmm)....
you really think any coach or owner is going to say themselves "well, i really want to win...and that negro is REALLY good....but dammit, i just can't have negro on my team...i'm going with the white guy. those negro's always screw something up..."
come on.

capitalism smashes racism in this instance...

[Extra Cheese]

teams can't AFFORD to let racist attitudes get in the way of putting a good team together...

but they do

many coaches who have proven that they suck keep popping up while the black coaches get overlooked

[Qdrop]

but they do

many coaches who have proven that they suck keep popping up while the black coaches get overlooked

examples?
SPECIFIC examples....not anectdotes.

[jabumbo]

its the same reason why most black QB's are better runners, and the white ones are better pocket passers

its the same reason why most white basketball players are good shooters

its the same reason why there are very few black players at all in the NHL

its the same reason why more american hockey players are physical grind it out players while the canadians have more finesse, and the russians and czechs have amazing wrist shots

[Qdrop]

its the same reason why most black QB's are better runners, and the white ones are better pocket passers

its the same reason why most white basketball players are good shooters

its the same reason why there are very few black players at all in the NHL

its the same reason why more american hockey players are physical grind it out players while the canadians have more finesse, and the russians and czechs have amazing wrist shots

cultural environment?

[Extra Cheese]

examples?
SPECIFIC examples....not anectdotes.


it took marvin lewis 3 years of being the eminent coordinator in the NFL before he got his chance to be a head coach. A white coach having that reputation as being the best coordinator around would not have to wait 3 years. sean payton was wack with the giants and wack with the cowboys but he gets a head coaching job meanwhile Maurice carthon who has been a more solid coach than payton probably wont get hired this off-season.

fucking dick jauron got hired,, come on…

but the current scene in the NFL is perfectly fit, for those who don’t think that race is a factor in the hiring process, to come out and be like “who is the qualified black coach that got overlooked?” and as I type this I’m realizing that I can side with that cuz there just aren’t many obvious choices, regardless of race, for head coaches. So I guess I’m doing a u-turn. Jim fassel isn’t getting any offers and he has a winning record and took his team to a super-bowl so you cant really say only black coaches are being shafted right now.

But whats gonna happen is that theres gonna be a new wave of coordinators and coaches who get hired and who will prove themselves from the bottom up and then when they’re ready for head coaching jobs we’ll see if the front office really doesnt look at race anymore in hiring for head coaches.

[Qdrop]

it took marvin lewis 3 years of being the eminent coordinator in the NFL before he got his chance to be a head coach. A white coach having that reputation as being the best coordinator around would not have to wait 3 years. sean payton was wack with the giants and wack with the cowboys but he gets a head coaching job meanwhile Maurice carthon who has been a more solid coach than payton probably wont get hired this off-season.

fucking dick jauron got hired,, come on…

but the current scene in the NFL is perfectly fit, for those who don’t think that race is a factor in the hiring process, to come out and be like “who is the qualified black coach that got overlooked?” and as I type this I’m realizing that I can side with that cuz there just aren’t many obvious choices, regardless of race, for head coaches. So I guess I’m doing a u-turn. Jim fassel isn’t getting any offers and he has a winning record and took his team to a super-bowl so you cant really say only black coaches are being shafted right now.

But whats gonna happen is that theres gonna be a new wave of coordinators and coaches who get hired and who will prove themselves from the bottom up and then when they’re ready for head coaching jobs we’ll see if the front office really doesnt look at race anymore in hiring for head coaches.

but what people always conveniantly forget...is that it's NOT all about a coaches win/loss record when picking a new coach. that is certainly part of it...but just as important are the personality of the prospective coach, his demands, how he melds with the rest of the personel and FO...

Marvin Lewis, for example does things HIS way...he expects ALOT of control over his team and decisions....many owners/presidents don't like that...they want someone who will listen to the FO more, or will run the offense/defense in a differant manner, someone who will take criticism...

[Extra Cheese]

winning is literally everything

[Extra Cheese]

marvin lewis not getting hired for 3 years doesnt have to do with how he melds with the rest of the personel and front office. sorry, im just not buying that.

[adam_f]

I saw a black kicker once. I bet he could down his own kickoffs.

[Extra Cheese]

I read your other posts and you really have your shit together.

no i dont

i'm just saying in the past it seemed like clear racism, right now you can say it isnt racism just a lack of coaches. i think in the future we'll see if the NFL has made progress or not.

[Qdrop]

marvin lewis not getting hired for 3 years doesnt have to do with how he melds with the rest of the personel and front office. sorry, im just not buying that.

so you REALLY think that front office guys around the nfl were like "eh....he runs a good defense...but he's black....i don't want no blacky coaching my team....he might steal my watch or something..."

[Qdrop]

we do not know how anyone answered the owner's questions in an interview, worked with the other staff, inspired the players, and so on, this is all speculation by us that this person is truly qualified.

word.

[Qdrop]

I meant that you were naming names and everything. I don't even know the names of the people who are in the runnings...like that dude you said that took three years or something. I don't know much about football. :confused:

then maybe you shouldn't be on this thread....

[Extra Cheese]

so you REALLY think that front office guys around the nfl were like "eh....he runs a good defense...but he's black....i don't want no blacky coaching my team....he might steal my watch or something..."


so you think they were like "as tradition goes we usually hire great coordinators who have proven themselves but for god's sake, his personality man!!! he only says 'hello' and doesnt follow it up with 'how are you' how can we possibly hire a man like that. yeah the GM had a deal worked out for him but no way we can allow him to be our coach with that personality!"

[Qdrop]

so you think they were like "as tradition goes we usually hire great coordinators who have proven themselves but for god's sake, his personality man!!! he only says 'hello' and doesnt follow it up with 'how are you' how can we possibly hire a man like that. yeah the GM had a deal worked out for him but no way we can allow him to be our coach with that personality!"

that would be more likely then "eh....he runs a good defense...but he's black....i don't want no blacky coaching my team....he might steal my watch or something..."

marvin lewis isn't known as the most personable guy....plus, we don't know how much $$ he was demanding...alot of differant variables....and i don't think brown skin was one of them.

[Extra Cheese]

that would be more likely then "eh....he runs a good defense...but he's black....i don't want no blacky coaching my team....he might steal my watch or something..."

marvin lewis isn't known as the most personable guy....plus, we don't know how much $$ he was demanding...alot of differant variables....and i don't think brown skin was one of them.

half the coaches arent known as personable people.. lewis said money wasnt an issue when buffalo passed on him for greg williams(of course thats what he said,, herm edwards said the same thing and then a few years later was bitching about being paid crap) but if you're gonna bring up money being a reason then let it be known we he interviewed with buffalo money wasnt an issue

[Qdrop]

half the coaches arent known as personable people.. lewis said money wasnt an issue when buffalo passed on him for greg williams(of course thats what he said,, herm edwards said the same thing and then a few years later was bitching about being paid crap) but if you're gonna bring up money being a reason then let it be known we he interviewed with buffalo money wasnt an issue

okay then...greg williams vs. marvin lewis.

greg williams coached the titans to the #1 defense in 2000 (the ravens were #2 in 2000 btw).
both got thier teams to the superbowl (titans in 99, ravens in 2000)

i'm not sure how you can think Lewis had any clear advantage... where race just HAD to be the deciding factor.

[Extra Cheese]

both have just about equal resume/credibility, williams led his team to number one ranked defense, lewis lead his team to fewest points allowed in NFL history. williams gets hired in 2000. Lewis gets hired 3 years later after being turned downed numerous times. I wonder why? his personality isnt why. if he were white it wouldnt have taken 3 years to get hired.

[rirv]

Now you’ll sing a song of liberty for blacks and paks and jocks
And they’ll take you from this dump you’re in and stick you in a box
Then they’ll take you to cloughprior and shove you in the ground
But you’ll stick your head back out and shout we’ll have another round!

[marsdaddy]

Why aren't there women coaches? Asian? blah blah...As in, there are no women (Frontiere doesn't count, as she inherited the team) or Asians who own teams? Very insightful, metroboy.
capitalism smashes racism in this instance...You're right, but not for the reasons you state. Whether NFL owners hire a black or white coach -- and whether their teams win or lose -- these white people still make millions of dollars from owning teams with guaranteed profits.

Extra Cheese brings up a perfect example. Why did Williams get a job 3 years before Lewis? What about Romeo Crennel? How many years did he have to wait?

Why are there so few -- 1 in NFL, 1 in MLB -- black executives who run teams? While the stereotypes of black QBs have mostly been broken down -- maybe not for Limbaugh or O'Reilly? -- the ones about black coaches -- Q believes they must not interview well?! -- black hockey players, and black executives in general still exist.