What do you think ...

[louise]

I as a woman like man , man like's woman , lesbien woman like's woman and homo guy's like's guy's . Yess , okee , i feel that way because i just do , i can't explain because it's a feeling....so if we think that this is not a choice but a feeling ( cause i can't emagine sp ? a lesbien or homo will make the choice for that if he / she had the choice to be like everybody els straight )...then a pedophile has got the same (trouble ") he just feels like that, isn't it right if i say then you can't ever make a person like that to behave "normal and quit doing that horrible stuff to kids.......

[Freebasser]

What the fuck
a?

[TurdBerglar]

louise wants to fuck the kids

[Freebasser]

Proanbtl

[louise]

Well like you can't changes them and has no meaning to tread / treadment for that so why try to and not just stop live for them cause how manny live's can he / she ruin ??

[louise]

louise wants to fuck the kids

fuck you that's just stupid and very rude to say......

[tracky]

ummm...

oooh kay



touching little children is never right



personally i think homosexuals aren't quite right either. ie i think they have some issues, like they hate their father or mother or something like that, whether they say it's all natural or whatever. it's just not the way things were meant to be. penis goes in vagina to make babies and that's pretty much all there is to it. but whatever, i'm not here to tell them to stop being gay, i just don't think it's natural, like when they say they're born that way i don't agree, it's just their way of being in denial

[TurdBerglar]

fuck you that's just stupid and very rude to say......


well...

[louise]

well...

Well :mad: What ???? :confused:

[Pres Zount]

Homosexuality doesn't hurt anyone.

Nonces where usually abused as children, and abuse other children as a result. It's not "normal".

[Freebasser]

YOPUR FACE! (mad:

[TurdBerglar]

Well :mad: What ???? :confused:


do you know who you're talking to?

[ericlee]

Homosexuality doesn't hurt anyone.

Nonces where usually abused as children, and abuse other children as a result. It's not "normal".

you say homosexuality doesn't hurt anyone but there has been many cases when the parents found out and either killed themselves, the person who is gay got upset because they know thier parents aren't happy with their choice in life and then committed suicide or the parents just flat out killed them for their choice.

I guess what I'm saying is that homosexuality doesn't hurt anyone if it's kept a secret. Most of the time that is.

[louise]

Homosexuality doesn't hurt anyone.

Nonces where usually abused as children, and abuse other children as a result. It's not "normal".


Ofcourse it's not normale...that is not what i am saying
but i don't agree with doing that because you had that horrible experense (sp ? ) yourself in the past , than someone should never do that to someone els because they know it's so horrible i think that's a simple excus (sp?) they should know better....

[ms.peachy]

you say homosexuality doesn't hurt anyone but there has been many cases when the parents found out and either killed themselves, the person who is gay got upset because they know thier parents aren't happy with their choice in life and then committed suicide or the parents just flat out killed them for their choice.

I guess what I'm saying is that homosexuality doesn't hurt anyone if it's kept a secret. Most of the time that is.

WHAT????

So, it doesn't hurt anyone to live a lie, and pretend to be something you're not, out of fear?

[ms.peachy]

Ofcourse it's not normale...that is not what i am saying
but i don't agree with doing that because you had that horrible experense (sp ? ) yourself in the past , than someone should never do that to someone els because they know it's so horrible i think that's a simple excus (sp?) they should know better....

I think the problem with your argument is where you say 'they know'. As in, they know it's horrible, they know better, etc etc. because the problem is that quite often they DON'T. Part of the psychology of abuse is that for some people, the clues about what is right and what is wrong become horrbily confused, They may know it's illegal and behaviour that needs to be hidden or they will get into trouble, but they honestly don't intrinsically believe they are 'wrong' because their internal wiring is all messed up as a result oof their own experiences as young children. This is also why it's such a difficult situation to treat - its nearly impossible to undo the damage that has been done.

[zorra_chiflada]

joe is right.

homosexuality is fine and normal, because it doesn't hurt anyone. the act of homosexuality does not hurt anyone. it's a biological thing. it has nothing to do with what's "right" or not. they are not "in denial" of "the right sexuality," they are biologically homosexual.

paedophilia is a sickness, a mental disorder.

[tracky]

that's just stating opinion as fact :rolleyes: You can have your opinion and I'll have mine. Like I said, I don't care if they're gay because for the most part it doesn't hurt anyone, but I just don't believe it's biological.

[ms.peachy]

I just don't believe it's biological.
If, in the face of all evolving scientific evidence, you want to cling to the antiquated notion that this is somehow a 'choice', I suppose no one can stop you.

[Pres Zount]

you say homosexuality doesn't hurt anyone but there has been many cases when the parents found out and either killed themselves, the person who is gay got upset because they know thier parents aren't happy with their choice in life and then committed suicide or the parents just flat out killed them for their choice.

I guess what I'm saying is that homosexuality doesn't hurt anyone if it's kept a secret. Most of the time that is.

So you're saying that homosexuality can hurt someone by proxy if that person is a bigoted piece of shit. Nice work.

[roosta]

homosexuality would hurt your bum bum id say.

[tracky]

If, in the face of all evolving scientific evidence, you want to cling to the antiquated notion that this is somehow a 'choice', I suppose no one can stop you.

no I'm not saying it's a choice, but I'm just not convinced it's genetic

[ericlee]

So you're saying that homosexuality can hurt someone by proxy if that person is a bigoted piece of shit. Nice work.

So be it, even if the person's a bigoted piece of shit. Fact is that it's happened. I just see that statement is a little far fetched from reflecting on events that have happened due to the choice of one to become homosexual.

[Kid Presentable]

The problem is, that if homosexuality is biological regarding the fact that people want to fuck their bretheren, then isn't paedophilia the same, in regards to buggering choirboys?

Or am I missing the point?

[ms.peachy]

The problem is, that if homosexuality is biological regarding the fact that people want to fuck their bretheren, then isn't paedophilia the same, in regards to buggering choirboys?

Or am I missing the point?
Kinda, but you and the OP both.

You are wanting to link homosexuality and paedophilia as either both being inborn, or both being 'learned behaviours'.

All credible evidence suggests that homosexuality is genetically based.

All credible evidence suggests that paedophelia is a mental disorder brought about by a conditioned response.

Very, very different things.

[Kid Presentable]

Kinda, but you and the OP both.

You are wanting to link homosexuality and paedophilia as either both being inborn, or both being 'learned behaviours'.

All credible evidence suggests that homosexuality is genetically based.

All credible evidence suggests that paedophelia is a mental disorder brought about by a conditioned response.

Very, very different things.

Fair enough. I'd never thought of paedophilia as being condonable, but more that if you trace any prediliction far enough you can find a predisposition. Maybe that makes conditional factors more influentital, maybe it doesn't.

[Nuzzolese]

Pediphiles don't always consider themselves to be homosexuals, even if they abuse a child of their same sex.

[Kid Presentable]

Pediphiles don't always consider themselves to be homosexuals, even if they abuse a child of their same sex.

But they both rely on an attraction that is unpalatble to many. One obviously moreso than the other.

[Nuzzolese]

We can't say what someone would have been like if they hadn't endured abuse. Some people who were sexually abused grow up to be quite confused about what they want in a sexual partner, some become abusive and some not. There are so many ways people are abused and at different times in their childhood, and so many ways people react to it, that it's hard to look at the same actions committed by hundreds of different people and assume they all resulted from the same influence.

[Nuzzolese]

But they both rely on an attraction that is unpalatble to many. One obviously moreso than the other.

You're looking at two different behaviors that share small similarities (unpalatable to you and "many") and assuming they come from the same source. Aren't there large differences in the behaviors as well? Isn't homosexuality usually a lifestyle marked by a mutual relationship between consenting adults? Pedophilia is usually marked by feelings of control and violence.

Additionally, no matter what the pedophile may want or enjoy, the child is the one in need of protection. It doesn't matter if the adult is making a choice or not, when you consider that a child is in danger. So I don't think it should even be up for discussion whether or not a pedophile should be allowed to fulfill his desires.

[Qdrop]

no I'm not saying it's a choice, but I'm just not convinced it's genetic

then what the fuck are you saying?

[Qdrop]

All credible evidence suggests that paedophelia is a mental disorder brought about by a conditioned response.



there are many documented cases of paedpheliacs who have no history of being abused themselves.

i think it is quite credible that paedophelia can be biological based, just as homosexuality.

however, that does not mean it should be condoned.

[ms.peachy]

We can't say what someone would have been like if they hadn't endured abuse. Some people who were sexually abused grow up to be quite confused about what they want in a sexual partner, some become abusive and some not. There are so many ways people are abused and at different times in their childhood, and so many ways people react to it, that it's hard to look at the same actions committed by hundreds of different people and assume they all resulted from the same influence.
Yes, exactly. There's no tidy explanation that you can box every person who's ever been abused into. There are so many factors - age at which the abuse began, was it a one time event or years of systematic trauma, was it a trusted family member or an 'outsider', was the family otherwise close or quite dysfunctional, etc etc ad infinitum. So the scale of damage ranges from those who are completely, utterly, irretrievable messed up to others who, with some introspection, are able to sort themsleves out and get on with life relatively unaffected.

It is worth pointing out, too, that there are people out there who are technically paedophiles, in that they are attracted to children, but who are also quite capable of recognising it within themselves and not acting upon it.

[ms.peachy]

there are many documented cases of paedpheliacs who have no history of being abused themselves.

i think it is quite credible that paedophelia can be biological based, just as homosexuality.

however, that does not mean it should be condoned.
I don't believe the only way the response is 'conditioned' is by abuse, though. I think there can be far more benign episodes that can provoke a person to associate sexual stimulation with children. It is far less common, but I think it does happen.

I have never seen any study that points to any biological basis for paedophilia. I will be happy to look at one if you can find it, but I am ver skeptical of it as a theory.

[marsdaddy]

Isn't homosexuality usually a lifestyle marked by a mutual relationship between consenting adults? Pedophilia is usually marked by feelings of control and violence. EXACTLY!
Additionally, no matter what the pedophile may want or enjoy, the child is the one in need of protection. It doesn't matter if the adult is making a choice or not, when you consider that a child is in danger. So I don't think it should even be up for discussion whether or not a pedophile should be allowed to fulfill his desires.A one-sided predisposition, at best or should spousal abusers and rapists be allowed to fulfill their desires, too?

[Pres Zount]

So be it, even if the person's a bigoted piece of shit. Fact is that it's happened. I just see that statement is a little far fetched from reflecting on events that have happened due to the choice of one to become homosexual.

I don't even understand that post, but I take it you are disagreeing with me.

What if two homo parents adopted a kid, and it grew up to be straight, and they were so offended they killed themselves? Would that make hetrosexuality wrong?? Does that mean that hetrosexuality "hurts people"?

Seriously.

[tracky]

then what the fuck are you saying?

I'm saying you don't choose to think a certain way, but your experiences lead you to think a certain way.

How about citing some of this evidence that it's genetic rather than just stating it?

[ericlee]

I don't even understand that post, but I take it you are disagreeing with me.

What if two homo parents adopted a kid, and it grew up to be straight, and they were so offended they killed themselves? Would that make hetrosexuality wrong?? Does that mean that hetrosexuality "hurts people"?

Seriously.

I've heard about it, read about it and there's probably some talk shows that have covered the topic. Obviously the decision to become homosexual has pushed someone to that length. If homosexuality didn't hurt them, then what did?

So every kid that's adopted totally agrees with the fact that they were raised by homosexuals when they realise what it's all about? Maybe his choice hurt them if he decided to become straight. I really wouldn't doubt if there are any relative cases.

People's choices may hurt other people. Not everybody understands each other. If a person's choice to be a homo caused the other person to react in an extreme way, then it hurt them.

[Medellia]

I'm saying you don't choose to think a certain way, but your experiences lead you to think a certain way.

How about citing some of this evidence that it's genetic rather than just stating it?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/4215427.stm

There. Now will you and eric please stop saying it's a "choice" or a "decision"?

[tracky]

I'm saying you don't choose to think a certain way, but your experiences lead you to think a certain way.

Read it again. I'm pretty sure serial killers don't choose to become serial killers, either.

ps. no i'm not equating being gay with being a serial killer, so please don't go down that path. :rolleyes: It's to illustrate a point.


Regardless of whether sexual orientation is determined by nature or nurture or both, the most important thing is that lesbians and gay men are treated equally and are allowed to live their life without discrimination.

And I do agree with that, so don't go thinking I hate gays or anything like that. I couldn't care less what other people do with themselves.

[Medellia]

Read it again. I'm pretty sure serial killers don't choose to become serial killers, either.

ps. no i'm not equating being gay with being a serial killer, so please don't go down that path. :rolleyes: It's to illustrate a point.
What? This doen't make any sense.

[tracky]

whether sexual orientation is determined by nature or nurture

I'm going with nurture. Does it make sense yet? Even the article you linked to says environmental factors are a potential influence. I'd go even further and say they are an influence.

[Medellia]

whether sexual orientation is determined by nature or nurture

I'm going with nurture. Does it make sense yet? Even the article you linked to says environmental factors are a potential influence. I'd go even further and say they are an influence.
So you're going to just completely overlook the evidence that shows that homosexuality is genetic, even if a small portion of gay men are that way due to their environment?

[tracky]

That's hardly solid evidence you pointed to. 1 study with "About 60% of these brothers shared identical DNA on three chromosomes - chromosome 7, 8 and 10." is hardly evidence, imo. But that's fine, you have your opinion, I'll have mine. The fact they were brothers can add to the "nuture" side too, you know.

"Campaigners say equality is the more important issue."

[ericlee]

eric please stop saying it's a "choice" or a "decision"?

so what you're trying to tell me is that every homo person has been born that way and has lived that way for the rest of his life? There's never been anybody that has no homosexual genetics nor has never been nutured homosexually just decide one day in his future that he wanted to try something different, as in sleeping with men and then decided he liked that orientation over being hetrosexual? Or vice versa, a person who has the genetics or has been nutured in the environment but in the distant future, he has chosen to become hetrosexual?

That wouldn't be considered choice or decision?