Israel occupation is justified?

[fucktopgirl]

IF this is yours thougs, first you are fucked! Secondly, watch thoses two movies, it might open your eyes on the situation.

And if you are intelligent and already know that Lies are beings propulses into the stratosphere in regard of the Israelien/palestien conflict, this is still good too watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCL6WdnuNp4&mode=related&search=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mo2HW4T7wK4&mode=related&search=

It is really amazing to see at what extent the media , americans that is, are so full of shit.

Who can still believe that Israel are victims and that their are defending themselves? That the land they are occupying is there?

It just can be ignorants morons!

[baltogrl71]

are you in israel? when was the last time you were there? you grew up there right? NO, and just because you picked some other bullshit media to get your fucked info from doesn't make that correct either! You are the fucking moron, go there live there learn there and then come back and talk until then shut the fuck up!

[fucktopgirl]

are you in israel? when was the last time you were there? you grew up there right? NO, and just because you picked some other bullshit media to get your fucked info from doesn't make that correct either! You are the fucking moron, go there live there learn there and then come back and talk until then shut the fuck up!

What a constructive argument!(y)
No i never live/travel there and my "bullshit media" are maybe far less mediocre then the propaganda that is being showed on tv and newspapers.

So ,you agree with what your fucked governement is doing?
Palestinians merited to died and being treated like fucking cockroachs?

Dont you see that unfairness is really at his apogee in your country. That Israel is doing actions that are banned and denonced by the international community?

[QueenAdrock]

Palestinians have blood on their hands, too. Neither are "victims" in this case. They're both equally responsible for committing atrocities.

[Tone Capone]

Palestinians have blood on their hands, too. Neither are "victims" in this case. They're both equally responsible for committing atrocities.

Exactly.

I would actually prefer if the Palestinians were cut some slack but, they are guilty in this too. What disgusts me as well is the fact that Muslim nations will use the Palestinian cause to justify their actions when it comes to terrorism when in these same Muslim countries, Palestinians are considered the lowest of the low. Everyone uses propaganda too, looks like the Muslim countries are just better at it.

[fucktopgirl]

Palestinians have blood on their hands, too. Neither are "victims" in this case. They're both equally responsible for committing atrocities.

Both equally??
This is a really BIASED vision of the issue.

I dont know how you came to the conclusion that both party are equivalent in this war?

Palestinians have blood on their hands because they are being attacked and persecuted. They ARE defending themselves and showing their disagreement with the situation. Of courses they are responding with violence because there is not others options ; resolution of the problem with peace talking does not work. So what are they supposed to do , just accepted their faith and not protesting?

Sorry ,but it is not an equal affair! And yes , they are VICTIMS of the aggression of israel that want to expand their fucking kingdom.

[Bob]

hey remember when israel was just starting out as a country and all the surrounding nations wanted to stomp them out of existence? no? oh

you make it sound like israel just became a country and immediately went "IT'S ALL OURS NOW, BITCHES"

i'm not really an expert on the history of the region but my understanding is that it's more complicated than that

[Helvete]

hey remember when israel was just starting out as a country and all the surrounding nations wanted to stomp them out of existence? no? oh
I'm going to start my own country in your house, and you can't do shit about it.

CAN'T YOU SEE, EVIL JEWS!

[Helvete]

+

actually, get the fuck out of your house, it's mine now.

[QueenAdrock]

Both equally??
This is a really BIASED vision of the issue.

Hahaha. *I* have a biased view, for refusing to say that Israel is the devil and Palestine is innocent of anything and everything. Right.

Has it ever occurred to you that the Palestinians may start attacks without being provoked by Israel first? It's been known to happen.

[fucktopgirl]

Hahaha. *I* have a biased view, for refusing to say that Israel is the devil and Palestine is innocent of anything and everything. Right.

Well , in this case :YES
Israel(zionnists) came to palestine and appropriated the land of the palestinian.
So who start the mess? They could have come in peace and accept to live peacefully together like it was the case back in history when differents arabs tribes and jews tribes where living in perfect harmony or at least more then today.

Has it ever occurred to you that the Palestinians may start attacks without being provoked by Israel first? It's been known to happen.

Well, they have been provoked since 1917( with the balfour accord) where a jewish state was support and established in palestine.But the cherry on the sunday would be in 1948, when the state of israel was proclamed and palestinians where being put in refugee camps(750 000 approx).

Since then, the ethnic cleansing is going strong....So as far as i am concern Israel are the instigators and Palestine is in constant state of provocation.

[Bob]

I'm going to start my own country in your house, and you can't do shit about it.

CAN'T YOU SEE, EVIL JEWS!

yeah yeah show me your papers

[Pres Zount]

Palestinians have blood on their hands, too. Neither are "victims" in this case. They're both equally responsible for committing atrocities.

So, all palestinians and all isralies are guilty now?

[sam i am]

Oh criminy.

Israelis (they were called Hebrews then) were in the "Holy Land" long before the "Palestinians." Unless, of course, you want to call the modern Palestinians the ancestors of the Galileeans (David and Goliath anyone?).

If you are a Biblical person, you know that the Jews believe God gave them dominion over the Holy Land long before modern Palestinians even existed.

When the Jews were dispersed (Diaspora) to the rest of the world, it didn't mean their land didn't still belong to them, in their view.

Just because a bunch of Bedouins and Arabs moved in/through there didn't give them the title to the land.

Then, when the Palestinians were GIVEN a homeland by the victorious powers of WWII, they made such a mess of their relationship with their fellow "Jordanians" (which, BTW, is a made up ethnicity like Iraqis), King Hussein kicked them out of Jordan and made them into an Israeli problem in Gaza and the West Bank.

End of history lesson.

[Pres Zount]

"Unless, of course..."

"If you are a Biblical person..."

"... in their view."

so many historical facts!

hmm, yes I see what you mean. I suppose all palestinians are guilty.

[sam i am]

"Unless, of course..."

"If you are a Biblical person..."

"... in their view."

so many historical facts!

hmm, yes I see what you mean. I suppose all palestinians are guilty.

Don't put words in my mouth, please. I don't think "all palestinians are guilty." Rather, I think they've been poorly led, exploited for their propaganda value by their neighbors, and eschewed from living in their homeland by their brethren, the "Jordanians."

[Pres Zount]

apologies, I thought you were replying directly to myself.

[QueenAdrock]

So, all palestinians and all isralies are guilty now?

Both countries are, yes. They're both guilty of committing wartime atrocities. Naturally, there are bystanders and civilians in each country who do not want the war, if that's what you're insinuating. However, I thought was common knowledge and therefore didn't think it need to be pointed out.

[fucktopgirl]

Oh criminy.

Israelis (they were called Hebrews then) were in the "Holy Land" long before the "Palestinians." Unless, of course, you want to call the modern Palestinians the ancestors of the Galileeans (David and Goliath anyone?).

If you are a Biblical person, you know that the Jews believe God gave them dominion over the Holy Land long before modern Palestinians even existed.

When the Jews were dispersed (Diaspora) to the rest of the world, it didn't mean their land didn't still belong to them, in their view.

Just because a bunch of Bedouins and Arabs moved in/through there didn't give them the title to the land.

Then, when the Palestinians were GIVEN a homeland by the victorious powers of WWII, they made such a mess of their relationship with their fellow "Jordanians" (which, BTW, is a made up ethnicity like Iraqis), King Hussein kicked them out of Jordan and made them into an Israeli problem in Gaza and the West Bank.

End of history lesson.

hahaha, please dont ever come a history teacher!
YOur history lesson was not compelling at all.

Did you ever heard of the semitics tribes?
Arabians, jews, arameans and others where semites peoples.
Thoses tribes did all coexisted togethers, in the area of palestine, lebannon, "the levant" ,before the idea of creating an all jews state was seeded!

[Pres Zount]

Both countries are, yes. They're both guilty of committing wartime atrocities. Naturally, there are bystanders and civilians in each country who do not want the war, if that's what you're insinuating. However, I thought was common knowledge and therefore didn't think it need to be pointed out.

There are people out there that believe palestinian civilians deserve what they get. I jumped the gun thinking you would, though.

[fucktopgirl]

Both countries are, yes. They're both guilty of committing wartime atrocities. Naturally, there are bystanders and civilians in each country who do not want the war, if that's what you're insinuating. However, I thought was common knowledge and therefore didn't think it need to be pointed out.

Who is bulldozing houses and put people in refugee camps?

Who is killing people with their new states of military weapons?

Who is controling ressources( water)?

Who is controlling the other "va et vient" ?

Who is destroying the other infrastructures?


Who is commiting the most outrageous ATROCITIES ??

[sam i am]

YOur history lesson was not compelling at all.

Did you ever heard of the semitics tribes?
Arabians, jews, arameans and others where semites peoples.
Thoses tribes did all coexisted togethers, in the area of palestine, lebannon, "the levant" ,before the idea of creating an all jews state was seeded!

No, my "history lesson," as you put it, may not have been compelling to you, but the truth rarely is.

You must have really hurt yourself trying to come up with "Arabians, jews, and arameans and others..." Just stop embarrassing yourself. The term you WANTED to use, I'm sure, is Canaanites, which, according to research, were a peoples who were ONE of the Semitic inhabitants of the ancient land of Canaan (the PART of Palestine between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea).

Canaan, for those who don't know, was also the fourth son of Ham and grandson of Noah, definitely a jew and spoken to by God to create the Ark and avoid the destruction of the Great Flood (40 days and 40 nights anyone?)

Anyhow, whether you believe the Biblical account literally or figuratively (and by figuratively, I mean that most serious scholars agree that there was some type of flood during the period of Noah, although most doubt it was worldwide), a serious shake up of the inhabitants of the region took place during this time, leading to the land being conquered by the Jews.

Israel was founded in 933 B.C. by Jeroboam and also refers to the descendants of Jacob. Israel is defined as "the whole Hebrew people, past, present, and future, regarded as the chosen people of Jehovah by virtue of the covenant of Jacob," wherein God promised the land to the Jews, NOT the "Palestinians."

Whether by faith or right of conquest, the "Palestinians" are not the heirs of the land in that area.

[Bob]

Whether by faith or right of conquest, the "Palestinians" are not the heirs of the land in that area.

i suppose this is a different topic entirely, but do you believe that america belongs to the indians as well, or...it's just i dunno, faith and conquest, those are kind of the only claims we have to this place if you think about it

[sam i am]

i suppose this is a different topic entirely, but do you believe that america belongs to the indians as well, or...it's just i dunno, faith and conquest, those are kind of the only claims we have to this place if you think about it

Unfortunately for those who weep for the indigenous peoples of the world (or the dodo bird for that matter), history is a cruel mistress.

Right of conquest has invariably proven to be the winner throughout history against every other type of "right."

Kill off your enemies, occupy their land, claim it for yourself, and screw those who were there previously never fails to claim the prize. Show me examples elsewise....

[Bob]

Unfortunately for those who weep for the indigenous peoples of the world (or the dodo bird for that matter), history is a cruel mistress.

Right of conquest has invariably proven to be the winner throughout history against every other type of "right."

Kill off your enemies, occupy their land, claim it for yourself, and screw those who were there previously never fails to claim the prize. Show me examples elsewise....

i'm just not understanding you is all. if i'm reading you right (and i may not be, i'm on like 3 hours of sleep, so forgive me if that's the case), you feel that the israelites are the rightful heirs of the land, even though they were conquested out. so do you feel that the native americans are the rightful heirs of this land, too?

[sam i am]

i'm just not understanding you is all. if i'm reading you right (and i may not be, i'm on like 3 hours of sleep, so forgive me if that's the case), you feel that the israelites are the rightful heirs of the land, even though they were conquested out. so do you feel that the native americans are the rightful heirs of this land, too?

Nope. Might makes right. Whoever has the might makes the rules and rules the land. The US is what it is. Anglos "conquered" it. If the Native Americans ever have enough might to conquer it back, then they'll make the rules.

[fucktopgirl]

No, my "history lesson," as you put it, may not have been compelling to you, but the truth rarely is.

You must have really hurt yourself trying to come up with "Arabians, jews, and arameans and others..." Just stop embarrassing yourself. The term you WANTED to use, I'm sure, is Canaanites, which, according to research, were a peoples who were ONE of the Semitic inhabitants of the ancient land of Canaan (the PART of Palestine between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea).

Canaan, for those who don't know, was also the fourth son of Ham and grandson of Noah, definitely a jew and spoken to by God to create the Ark and avoid the destruction of the Great Flood (40 days and 40 nights anyone?)

Anyhow, whether you believe the Biblical account literally or figuratively (and by figuratively, I mean that most serious scholars agree that there was some type of flood during the period of Noah, although most doubt it was worldwide), a serious shake up of the inhabitants of the region took place during this time, leading to the land being conquered by the Jews.

Israel was founded in 933 B.C. by Jeroboam and also refers to the descendants of Jacob. Israel is defined as "the whole Hebrew people, past, present, and future, regarded as the chosen people of Jehovah by virtue of the covenant of Jacob," wherein God promised the land to the Jews, NOT the "Palestinians."

Whether by faith or right of conquest, the "Palestinians" are not the heirs of the land in that area.

CAnaanites where a semitic people and which palestinians, jews, christians descended from .There are the ancestors of the jews and palestinians.
Even modern genetic has showed it. There are coming from the same area and place thus they are all intitled to live in palestine.

WHere the shit start to happen is when the zionnism movement was created, fundamentalists jews, and this created a big rifts between the two religions.

[sam i am]

CAnaanites where a semitic people and which palestinians, jews, christians descended from .There are the ancestors of the jews and palestinians.
Even modern genetic has showed it. There are coming from the same area and place thus they are all intitled to live in palestine.

WHere the shit start to happen is when the zionnism movement was created, fundamentalists jews, and this created a big rifts between the two religions.

No again. Where the "big rifts" happened is when the Jews returned to their ancestral homeland, founded a country based on the promises of God (in their eyes) and were immediately attacked by their neighbors. The Palestinians are pawns, fuckedupgirl, not the rightful occupants of the lands they claim. Jordan is their homeland and that's where (genetically, culturally, etc., et al.) they belong.

[Ali]

you make it sound like israel just became a country and immediately went "IT'S ALL OURS NOW, BITCHES"more or less

[Bob]

more or less

i'll admit, i only have a casual knowledge of the history of modern israel, but my understanding of it goes like this:

allies win WWII and say "sorry about the holocaust, jews, here, have your holy land back"

and then the surrounding countries all go "no no no, this won't do, let's all invade them until they're dead"

only israel didn't die, it got strong, and paranoid.

again, i have a very casual understanding of the history, but i wasn't aware that israel immediately turned into an aggressor nation the moment it was born?

[Bob]

i should clarify a little...i recognize that the reasoning behind the creation of the state of israel after WWII was probably a good deal more complex than "sorry about the holocaust", but i confess, i'm not really familiar with it at all. my own uneducated opinion of it is that it's an example of the US & UK butting in on an area that they have no business butting in...on. but what was done was done and what followed followed.

i also don't want to make it sound like i think the muslim countries that were in the area were just a bunch of belligerent jerks that hate the jews or anything. again, it was the US & UK butting in and saying "hey guys, move over, would ya, we've got some new neighbors for you. i don't care how comfortable you were, move over!" i certainly wouldn't like it if anyone did that to me, either.

[Pres Zount]

sam i am, if you are so sure that might is right in this case, and you have no problems about a peoples taking all that they want form native americasn - why do you have a problem with the palestinians fighting to get the land bacK?

PS: all the bible talk and 'rightful heir from god' shit is getting annoying.

[Schmeltz]

i recognize that the reasoning behind the creation of the state of israel after WWII was probably a good deal more complex than "sorry about the holocaust", but i confess, i'm not really familiar with it at all


Oh man, this is some of the most wild history of the twentieth century. It goes much further than the US and UK being all buddy-buddy - if you ask me, it's the first post-WWII example of the US' transformation into the dominant interventionist power on the planet. Most of the histories I've read have pointed to the American takeover of intervention against Communism in Greece from the British as the earliest example of American foreign policy initiatives that define the country's interaction with the Cold War, but Israel followed the same pattern in the years before. The British governed the Palestine Mandate (as they were responsible for security in the Greek state) in the WWII years, but following the war found they were in no state to maintain their pre-eminent position in global politics and withdrew from the situation - to be succeeded by the Americans in their new role as the dominant military power on the planet with an ideological axe to grind against Communism and the military wherewithal to assert its policies in any theater of its choice.

The creation of Israel, like many subsequent Cold-War era American foreign policy initiatives, shows you a lot about the cultural influences that have informed the evolution of American society. America, and in particular 19th and 20th century American Christianity ((and, to an extent, finance and no I'm not being prejudiced or anti-Semitic that is the furthest thing from my mind but the fact is that a significant portion of the financial resources of Zionist movements were provided by American Jewish financiers in a completely non-conspiratorial and entirely natural setting completely in tune with strands of political thought at the time including the genocide of European Jews in Europe due to the Second World War)) has played a profound role in the history, demographics, and economics of Israel for very interesting reasons.

It goes to show how even the most complex and technologically advanced society in human history can be dominated by very archaic ways of thinking, and that people have a way of staying the same no matter what changes around them over time.

Fuck, my friends say I do this to them too.

[sam i am]

sam i am, if you are so sure that might is right in this case, and you have no problems about a peoples taking all that they want form native americasn - why do you have a problem with the palestinians fighting to get the land bacK?

PS: all the bible talk and 'rightful heir from god' shit is getting annoying.

I have no problems with the Palestinians fighting for what they think they deserve. When they get their asses kicked over and over, though, it's a bit annoying to have them bleating to the world that they're "refugees" and that they need international intervention to solve their "problem."

As for your PS, to hell with you. You can argue against the historical efficacy of the Bible if you want, but it's still a history that a broad swath of humanity believes in. If you choose to completely ignore it, you do so at your own peril.

As a clarification, I'm not a bible-thumper, as many of the oldtimers can attest, but the Bible's use as a historical document is not without precedent, nor should it be completely ignored.

[freetibet]

One interesting fact is that in the war of 1956, Israel was supported by the USSR and the whole Eastern block. As far as I know in 1967 roles changed and then we had the mighty year 1968 in Poland - with a majority of Jews who actually survived WWII being kicked out to "Syiam" (that's Thailand, not Zion;D).

I have much respect for Israel. Jews where such asses for 2000 years and then came the apogeum - Holocaust. And now? They could beat the shit out of all their neighbours :cool: I mean they are some good guys who eventually always win. I know it's a rather simple point of view ;)

[freetibet]

Btw. look at my proud signature!

"Hey, I'm FreeTibet which says for itself, plus I like Mike D and the evil Zionists" :eek:

[Pres Zount]

"Simple points of view" only begins to describe you.

[fucktopgirl]

One interesting fact is that in the war of 1956, Israel was supported by the USSR and the whole Eastern block. As far as I know in 1967 roles changed and then we had the mighty year 1968 in Poland - with a majority of Jews who actually survived WWII being kicked out to "Syiam" (that's Thailand, not Zion;D).

HUmm...go read more on the history of your wanabee country!

I have much respect for Israel. Jews where such asses for 2000 years and then came the apogeum - Holocaust. And now? They could beat the shit out of all their neighbours :cool: I mean they are some good guys who eventually always win. I know it's a rather simple point of view ;)

I understand for someone to be patriot of their country, being proud to be "insert country here". BUT when your country is attaining their politicals objectifs by destructions, injustices, no respect and by making blood flow like a river of agony and suffering. I think it is time to rethink your vision and be more critical. Even americans ,today , start to realized that their administration is lying and are hypocrites. So , your country is not":cool:" more like (n) for all the horrifics actions they are doing.

NObody talk no more about lebannon ..that amaze me, with all the fucking devastation they did there. It is not human, they litterally destroyed everything and polluated their coast and so on....
Are you also proud of this ??
You think that lebaneses people deserved it? oh yea , true, hezbollah kidnapped soldiers....pffft!!

Anyway ,let stick with one bloody mess:Palestine

And the zionnists are certainly not the "good guys" in this conflicts.....

[Bob]

HUmm...go read more on the history of your wanabee country!


what the fuck is this

he's from poland, not israel. he says it in the post, he has it in his location, for god's sake. and you tell US to read, geez

[fucktopgirl]

what the fuck is this

AS what did i say?

it seem pretty obvious to me!
Even tho he is from poland, he still is proud of the israel achievements and seem to think he is part of them. And what he did say make no sense!

[Bob]

AS what did i say?

it seem pretty obvious to me!
i suggest to him , freebrainspace, to go read more on the history of Israel!

i suggest to you, to read closer attention of the posts!

[fucktopgirl]

^ hahaha faster then me!

Anyway, that what i meant! That HE go read more on ISrael!

[Schmeltz]

fucktopgirl and freetibet are absolutely made for each other.

[Bob]

fucktopgirl and freetibet are absolutely made for each other.

i didn't wanna say anything, but yeah

[fucktopgirl]

fucktopgirl and freetibet are absolutely made for each other.


haha sure...and the flower of love is going strong between you and Bob!
Bob like to sleep with man..did you know?

[gorilla]

so what's up with this big victory parade Hezbollah is organizing.

I'm confused, you're referring to the destruction of Lebanon by Israel yet a parade is being orchestrated by Hezbollah to celebrate this as a victory.

Can you understand my confusion?

[fucktopgirl]

^ Maybe because Israel was not able to disloged the hezbollah in spite of all their efforts : HAssan NAzrallah is still alive and kicking stronger then ever.

Maybe that why they rejoiced...

[franscar]

so what's up with this big victory parade Hezbollah is organizing.

I'm confused, you're referring to the destruction of Lebanon by Israel yet a parade is being orchestrated by Hezbollah to celebrate this as a victory.

Can you understand my confusion?

Well, they still have the Israeli soldiers that kicked the whol shebang off, and they still have rockets and shit to go a shootin'.

Call it a draw and hold the replay next month.

[Qdrop]

food for thought:

http://www.amconmag.com/2004_05_24/article.html
christian Palestians

"...Yet U.S. media and politicians have become accustomed to thinking of and talking about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict as one in which an enlightened democracy is constantly forced to repel attacks from crazy-eyed Islamists bent on the destruction of the Jewish people and the imposition of an Islamic state. Palestinians are equated with Islamists, Islamists with terrorists. It is presumably because all organized Christian activity among Palestinians is non-political and non-violent that the community hardly ever hits the Western headlines; suicide bombers sell more copy than people who congregate for Bible study."

why do the oppressed christians not react like the muslims?

[sam i am]

fucktopgirl and freetibet are absolutely made for each other.

You're not the only one who noticed the sublimated flirting, eh?;)

[sam i am]

why do the oppressed christians not react like the muslims?

Because, despite all of the rantings that are commonly posted on these sites, Christians are used to being oppresed - throughout history.

Early Christians, until Emperor Constantine adopted Christianity as the official religion of the Roman Empire, were brutally hunted down and massacred.

Christians in China, today, are killed for owning Bibles (not to mention Saudi Arabia). Millions have dies for martyrdom in the interim.

But Christian persecution NEVER makes the headlines. Why do you think that is? Hmmmmm?

[DroppinScience]

But Christian persecution NEVER makes the headlines. Why do you think that is? Hmmmmm?

Well, it was pretty big headlines when that guy in Afghanistan converted to Christianity and was gonna be executed. Fortunately, they stopped the execution due to international outrage.

[baltogrl71]

What a constructive argument!(y)
No i never live/travel there and my "bullshit media" are maybe far less mediocre then the propaganda that is being showed on tv and newspapers.

So ,you agree with what your fucked governement is doing?
Palestinians merited to died and being treated like fucking cockroachs?

Dont you see that unfairness is really at his apogee in your country. That Israel is doing actions that are banned and denonced by the international community?
first of all you are mistaken, in many parts of our country Israel looks like the bully in the media.You have two movies I have friends and family there and when I want info I look everywhere not just two films. Israel is under constant attack, our children and innocent civilians are killed too, they are actually targeted, unlike palestinian peaceful civilians who are not.What you also fail to understand is that unfortunatly the radical psychos there use these people and hide behind them as propaganda to hurt Israels image and gain more sympathy.Just like in Lebanon everyone thinks it's hezbalah we are fighting, no its Iran and Syria and other very influentials who want us wiped off the face of the earth. You I'm sure living in peaceful canada have lots of opinions, but there is no way you can truly understand in your peacful world.Dig deeper my friend, before you judge.

[sam i am]

first of all you are mistaken, in many parts of our country Israel looks like the bully in the media.You have two movies I have friends and family there and when I want info I look everywhere not just two films. Israel is under constant attack, our children and innocent civilians are killed too, they are actually targeted, unlike palestinian peaceful civilians who are not.What you also fail to understand is that unfortunatly the radical psychos there use these people and hide behind them as propaganda to hurt Israels image and gain more sympathy.Just like in Lebanon everyone thinks it's hezbalah we are fighting, no its Iran and Syria and other very influentials who want us wiped off the face of the earth. You I'm sure living in peaceful canada have lots of opinions, but there is no way you can truly understand in your peacful world.Dig deeper my friend, before you judge.

Walk in my shoes before you judge what I do...

Good for you defending yourself and Israel baltogirl....

[sam i am]

Well, it was pretty big headlines when that guy in Afghanistan converted to Christianity and was gonna be executed. Fortunately, they stopped the execution due to international outrage.

A drop in the ocean compared to the daily deluge of "poor Palestinian refugees" and the endless images of Iraqi civilians painted all over the media.

[baltogrl71]

HUmm...go read more on the history of your wanabee country!



I understand for someone to be patriot of their country, being proud to be "insert country here". BUT when your country is attaining their politicals objectifs by destructions, injustices, no respect and by making blood flow like a river of agony and suffering. I think it is time to rethink your vision and be more critical. Even americans ,today , start to realized that their administration is lying and are hypocrites. So , your country is not":cool:" more like (n) for all the horrifics actions they are doing.

NObody talk no more about lebannon ..that amaze me, with all the fucking devastation they did there. It is not human, they litterally destroyed everything and polluated their coast and so on....
Are you also proud of this ??
You think that lebaneses people deserved it? oh yea , true, hezbollah kidnapped soldiers....pffft!!

Anyway ,let stick with one bloody mess:Palestine

And the zionnists are certainly not the "good guys" in this conflicts.....
So we should just let people kidnapp our soldiers and do nothing, I know that would be the canadian way. As far as Lebanon you really have no idea, if Israel wanted to we could have destroyed the place and wiped hezbalah out, but we didn't we held back and faught only what we were forced to.
Oh and you don't see zionist screaming for the destruction of any of the countries it is fighting, but sure the zionist are the bad guys.

[baltogrl71]

Walk in my shoes before you judge what I do...

Good for you defending yourself and Israel baltogirl....

Thank you.

[baltogrl71]

okay I am going to go take my zionist ass to celebrate my new jew year, and you know what I can because we are strong and not going anywhere.

peace and love to all my non-jewish friends have a good weekend!
to my fellow tribe members l'shanah tovah!

[fucktopgirl]

why do the oppressed christians not react like the muslims?

They are not oppressed...like the islamic people are. Are they? If so , news to my ears.


I am pretty sure, that christians palestinians are as pissed off as the muslims palestinians. WE talk about a population being displaced and destroy" the palestinians people'. I mean they could be palestinians bouddhism, or jews. It is not relevant here.


Because, despite all of the rantings that are commonly posted on these sites, Christians are used to being oppresed - throughout history.

hahaha good one, what about crusades, spanish inquisition, the europeens explorers...
Did they not KILLED for people to adopted their ideology?
Didi they not inflicted punishement upon thoses who where adoring a god differents from their?

I mean, for sure there has been death related to intolerance over religions , in every camps, ya know what i mean. BUt christianism win the champion title!

But Christian persecution NEVER makes the headlines. Why do you think that is? Hmmmmm?

Because christians Are part of the invaders...What happening now it is a political , economical and religion war. And the master of this war are what?

Christian and zionnisms, i will specified "mainly" thoses two.


Bush want to have sex with jesus and being pin in the ass by god.
HE think he is the fucking savior of the world by waging is stupid war on terrorism..

"WE will free this world of the terrorism, we will prevailed"

Hahahah yea, well go on and just pulverised yourself and your compatriots my friend" , this is what i would say to him.

[fucktopgirl]

So we should just let people kidnapp our soldiers and do nothing, I know that would be the canadian way.

oh god..not again the story about your two fucking soldiers, this is getting a bit annoying. And you can insult my country as much as you want that will not lift the guilt that ISrael is so full of .

As far as Lebanon you really have no idea, if Israel wanted to we could have destroyed the place and wiped hezbalah out, but we didn't we held back and faught only what we were forced to.

hahah yes, sure...
YOu must be very young..

YOU guys did not held back, god dammit, you practicaly detroyed every infrastructures there is there.How on earth ISrael has held back? A 36 days war , everything is in little pieces and you killed like thousands of innocents civilians. Oh i see, you did not launched a nuclear bomb..true your governement held back.


Oh and you don't see zionist screaming for the destruction of any of the countries it is fighting, but sure the zionist are the bad guys.

They are not screaming, they are acting and killing.

[gorilla]

^ Maybe because Israel was not able to disloged the hezbollah in spite of all their efforts : HAssan NAzrallah is still alive and kicking stronger then ever.

Maybe that why they rejoiced...

Yeah, but at what cost.

[Schmeltz]

You're not the only one who noticed the sublimated flirting, eh?


Well, that was the strongest message that came through from either of them.


Christians are used to being oppresed


Oh for fuck's sake, man. This is embarrassing. They stopped feeding Christians to the lions two millennia ago. You'd have a case if it was Buddhists or Shintoists or something who launched the trans-Atlantic slave trade, but trying to pretend Christians have been victimized as a group by contemporary history is completely ridiculous. Let's try and keep the discussion somewhere within the bounds of reality, alright?


unlike palestinian peaceful civilians who are not.


I appreciate your defense of a country with which you seem to identify, and you actually make some cogent points, but be realistic. The statistics corroborated by every source bear out that the Israeli government has absolutely no problem with killing civilians to advance its goals - a characteristic it shares with its fundamentalist enemies. Terrorists, I'm sure, also shake their heads and murmur transparent bullshit about the people they've unwillingly had to kill in order to advance their private ideological agendas. The means do not justify the ends.


the endless images of Iraqi civilians painted all over the media.


Aww, are the consequences of your government's toxic foreign policy interrupting your reality shows? Poor wittle guy.


but sure the zionist are the bad guys.


No difference between Zionism and Islamism. None at all. Nothing.

The domination of ideology over reason displayed here is ridiculous. No wonder there's so much trouble in the world, when people continents distant from the actuality of events are so devoted to the promotion of whatever abstract fantasies they can concoct based on the latest mass media sound bites. Blecchhh.

[fucktopgirl]

No difference between Zionism and Islamism. None at all. Nothing.

I cannot believe i will repeat myself again!

Sorry, there is a difference at the moment...The zionism are the ones invading and taking land, ressources and islamism are the ones defending and reacting to this confrontation . The rebellion movement that has been created among the muslims communities is in response to the zionism invasions and persecutions.

Are you in a state of oblivion?

The philosophy is the major difference between the two!

[fucktopgirl]

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=-5359685624521924184&q=zionism

A little brief history of the conflict and the clarifying situation about judaism and zionism.

[Monsieur Decuts]

I cannot believe i will repeat myself again!

Sorry, there is a difference at the moment...The zionism are the ones invading and taking land, ressources and islamism are the ones defending and reacting to this confrontation . The rebellion movement that has been created among the muslims communities is in response to the zionism invasions and persecutions.

Are you in a state of oblivion?

The philosophy is the major difference between the two!

you speak of land as if someone owns it.
that's your first mistake.
Throughout history its been a mad fucking dash to put stakes in every square meter of this earth, how can anyone claim historical rights to a land, all the can do is occupy it and fight off the people who try to take it from them...
how it was how it is how it always will be.

[fucktopgirl]

you speak of land as if someone owns it.
that's your first mistake.
Throughout history its been a mad fucking dash to put stakes in every square meter of this earth, how can anyone claim historical rights to a land, all the can do is occupy it and fight off the people who try to take it from them...
how it was how it is how it always will be.

I dont think that either jews or palestinians own this land..they should shared it like before the zionism movement was created. BUt Palestinians were there berofe the zionists and in a larger number : they should'nt suffer the displacement and genocide they have for the last 50 years.

Again look at this video... i concur with what it is depicted in it.
http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=-5359685624521924184&q=zionism

You are full of truth too: borders and appropriation of land (for political,economical strategies) have always and will still remain the major source of chaos in this world. Some country, people, are more tyrannic and blodd thirsty with their aim then others tho!

[Tone Capone]

I dont think that either jews or palestinians own this land..they should shared it like before the zionism movement was created. BUt Palestinians were there berofe the zionists and in a larger number : they should'nt suffer the displacement and genocide they have for the last 50 years.

Again look at this video... i concur with what it is depicted in it.
http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=-5359685624521924184&q=zionism

You are full of truth too: borders and appropriation of land (for political,economical strategies) have always and will still remain the major source of chaos in this world. Some country, people, are more tyrannic and blodd thirsty with their aim then others tho!

You remind me of those people who converted to Islam after the terrorists attacks on September 11th just for the attention... Here's a question. Are you going to actually do anything about your beliefs about how fucked up things are, or are you just going to post on internet and hope a terrorist won't kill you?

[fucktopgirl]

[QUOTE=Tone Capone]You remind me of those people who converted to Islam after the terrorists attacks on September 11th just for the attention...

you remind me of a whitekkk pimple on a fat ass.


Here's a question. Are you going to actually do anything about your beliefs about how fucked up things are, or are you just going to post on internet and hope a terrorist won't kill you?

What i am doing with my time is none of your business by the way, i am doing the hell i want, mmkkay? And i am doing something, trying to fucking wake up the mind of people like you , who are so embbeded in their little bubble of superficiality . WHo are blinded by their media and dont see pass them.

So either you post something intelligent or else you just shut the....

[Tone Capone]

you remind me of a whitekkk pimple on a fat ass

That's an interesting thing to say to a Black man. So I guess anyone who DOESN'T side with the terrorists is a "whitekkk pimple on a fat ass"?



What i am doing with my time is none of your business by the way, i am doing the hell i want, mmkkay? And i am doing something, trying to fucking wake up the mind of people like you , who are so embbeded in their little bubble of superficiality . WHo are blinded by their media and dont see pass them.

So either you post something intelligent or else you just shut the....
Read your post again and THEN tell me to post something intelligent.
ps. all your posts are predictable... except that kkk thing... that was just strange

[Tone Capone]

People like you are just like the right wing "conservatives". So blinded by your hate of the other side that common sense kinda gets left at the door.

[fucktopgirl]

really you are black?

i heard you where that guy who did get banned and was racist.what was you other alias??

Anyway , i will not descend deeper into personnal insults .

If you have nothing more to say on the subject of palestinians/israeliens, you can give us your reverence!

I feel no hate towards nobody, i am just outrage by this injustice.

[Tone Capone]

really you are black?

i heard you where that guy who did get banned and was racist.what was you other alias??



Of course I'm Black and where the hell did you hear that I was banned because I was racist (that's Robmoney).

[Tone Capone]

I feel no hate towards nobody, i am just outrage by this injustice.

Sure... and like I said what are you gonna do about it? Just sit around and post worthless mesages on a message board? The blame doesn't belong just on one side in the middle east.

[fucktopgirl]

Of course I'm Black and where the hell did you hear that I was banned because I was racist (that's Robmoney).

So i tough you where is other alias...my mistake!

I then take back my kkk compliment.

[Tone Capone]

So i tough you where is other alias...my mistake!

I then take back my kkk compliment.

LOL!!!!
You are forgiven for that mistake.

[baltogrl71]

oh god..not again the story about your two fucking soldiers, this is getting a bit annoying. And you can insult my country as much as you want that will not lift the guilt that ISrael is so full of .



hahah yes, sure...
YOu must be very young..

YOU guys did not held back, god dammit, you practicaly detroyed every infrastructures there is there.How on earth ISrael has held back? A 36 days war , everything is in little pieces and you killed like thousands of innocents civilians. Oh i see, you did not launched a nuclear bomb..true your governement held back.




They are not screaming, they are acting and killing.
Ok, I wont rag or your sorry ass country I will leave that to the funny boys who write south park and the rest of the world. Oh but just to let you know see I can because I un-like you have been to your week ass country and can speak from experience. As far as young you gotta lot a nerve sista I am way older and more experienced and well rounded than you and because of that am an objective thinker, something you should strive for.You are swayed by the propaganda of the extreme they set up shop in civilian places like schools and such so they will be attacked there because they have no regard for human life, in hopes to gain sympathy from the uneducated such as yourself.Oh and one last thought try speaking in french because your english sucks.

[Monsieur Decuts]

trying to pretend Christians have been victimized as a group by contemporary history is completely ridiculous. Let's try and keep the discussion somewhere within the bounds of reality, alright?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_Genocide

[Schmeltz]

I'm confused. How does this exhaustively researched example of ethnic cleansing translate into support for sam's assertion that Christians are constantly being oppressed but it's just never in the news?


because of that am an objective thinker


As a self-confessed Zionist you are hardly an objective thinker when it comes to this issue.

[baltogrl71]

I'm confused. How does this exhaustively researched example of ethnic cleansing translate into support for sam's assertion that Christians are constantly being oppressed but it's just never in the news?



As a self-confessed Zionist you are hardly an objective thinker when it comes to this issue.
no, that is not true yes I am a zionist, but if I think or see something is unjust I am logical enough to realize, I don't agree with every move the Israeli government makes.I just totally and completely belive in the state of Israel, not always the government they are not the same.

[Monsieur Decuts]

I'm confused. How does this exhaustively researched example of ethnic cleansing translate into support for sam's assertion that Christians are constantly being oppressed but it's just never in the news?


It has nothing to do with Sams argument, but with your statment..there has been oppression within "contemporary history".

The fact that way over half the world won't recognize the death of 1.5 million christian people as a "genocide" tends to back Sam. This was less than 100 years ago. Then the christians got the bomb, and the rest is a very very very small chunk of history.

[Schmeltz]

Before Christians had the bomb, they had the slave trade and their enormous colonial empires. Before that they had pogroms and Crusades. It's been Christians doing most of the oppressing for much more than a small chunk of history.

Furthermore, it's disingenuous to link the Armenian genocide with religious oppression - it was due to ethnic and political motives, more so than religious ideology, that the Turks carried it out, so far as I know.

I'll agree that Christian populations have experienced considerable oppression throughout history, but that has to stand against the fact that Christians have acted as history's most oppressive powers.


I am a zionist, but if I think or see something is unjust I am logical enough to realize


There's not much that's just or logical about Zionism, in my opinion.

[baltogrl71]

There's not much that's just or logical about Zionism, in my opinion.

Okay, that is your opinion and I don't judge you for that.As a jew I'm sure I have a much diferent perspective than you on the subject.;)

[fucktopgirl]

no, that is not true yes I am a zionist, but if I think or see something is unjust I am logical enough to realize, I don't agree with every move the Israeli government makes.I just totally and completely belive in the state of Israel, not always the government they are not the same.


So ,you are logical enough to realize actions that are unjusts yet you still support the creation of an all zionism state.

OK , i see your logic now....

As a self-confessed Zionist you are hardly an objective thinker when it comes to this issue.

exactly!

[fucktopgirl]

Are the israeli army are just lovely!!?

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=-2347953151064740545&q=palestine

I think that thoses internationals peacefreak are really brave, i would'nt put myself betweeen the army and the civilians to save people. I would'nt want to finished like Rachel Corrie...really brave they are !

Or another proof of the amazing humatarian work that the israel army did!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLWQLqtzP68

[baltogrl71]

[QUOTE=fucktopgirl]So ,you are logical enough to realize actions that are unjusts yet you still support the creation of an all zionism state.
first of all this statement just proves your ignorance, I support Israel as a jewish state, zionism is the belief of an all jewish state.Why is this so offensive to you? Most countries governments are all one religion, and no one says a word, but g-d forbid the jews from having their rightful place on earth.We have to be there, how else will the third temple be built?Last but not least I do not think that we agree on what is fair or just when it comes to the actions of Israel.I also know that you know very little on the matter and once again am asking you to please educate yourself, and in your journey please keep your educational tools diverse so you can than have an inteligent conversation.

[fucktopgirl]

first of all this statement just proves your ignorance, I support Israel as a jewish state, zionism is the belief of an all jewish state.Why is this so offensive to you?

Are you seriously asking me that question?
If so, just reread my posts on the matter and check the videos, that will give you an idea.

Most countries governments are all one religion, and no one says a word, but g-d forbid the jews from having their rightful place on earth.

Poor little guys... well go ahead and continue your massacre, you still got a couples of palestinians to kill, after that it is all yours.


Last but not least I do not think that we agree on what is fair or just when it comes to the actions of Israel.

NO REally.....

So the killing of innocents civilians seem fair to you then?

[Tone Capone]

So the killing of innocents civilians seem fair to you then?

Never. Yet you seem to forgive the terrorists for doing it.:confused:

[fucktopgirl]

Never. Yet you seem to forgive the terrorists for doing it.:confused:

WEll , more so like understanding their reaction. Somebody would come in my house and didacte me to stay in the closet and then constantly wipping,humiliating me and hurting me, i would retaliate.

How are they suppose to act then....Just shut their mouth and do the carpet on the floor?

And please dont use the term "terrorists"....Or if you use it , apply it to both party. Israel are fucking terrorists too , dont forget that!

[sam i am]

Before Christians had the bomb, they had the slave trade and their enormous colonial empires. Before that they had pogroms and Crusades. It's been Christians doing most of the oppressing for much more than a small chunk of history.

Furthermore, it's disingenuous to link the Armenian genocide with religious oppression - it was due to ethnic and political motives, more so than religious ideology, that the Turks carried it out, so far as I know.

I'll agree that Christian populations have experienced considerable oppression throughout history, but that has to stand against the fact that Christians have acted as history's most oppressive powers.

Ok, Schmeltz. At least this is a far more balanced and nuanced take on the subject.

What I asserted is that there has been, and continues to be, oppression against Christians.

I also gave the example of Chinese Christians, who are currently being persecuted and killed for their beliefs, and the fact that it is illegal to own a Bible in countries of the Middle East like Saudi Arabia.

Just because Christians are also persecuters (the Crusades and the Inquisition being the two most "recent" examples commonly given) does not absolve others of their complicity in persecution of Christians.

[Schmeltz]

zionism is the belief of an all jewish state.Why is this so offensive to you?


Because it's xenophobic and fundamentalist.


We have to be there, how else will the third temple be built?


Oh, well there's a rock-solid point in favour of your position. Try this for a comparative statement: the Jews all have to go, because how else will the Third Reich be established? There is no difference between the two questions.

I appreciate that your identification with Israel is probably well-founded and very personal, but if you ask me Zionism is as toxic and ignorant an ideology as Islamism. I know a few Jews who are not Zionists by any stretch of the imagination and who are open-minded enough to criticize Israel when criticism is warranted, instead of mounting the feeble defense of messianic eschatology.


Just because Christians are also persecuters (the Crusades and the Inquisition being the two most "recent" examples commonly given) does not absolve others of their complicity in persecution of Christians.


Perhaps not, but the fact that Christians are and have historically been history's most powerful and oppressive persecutors ought to give pause to the notion that "Christians know what it means to be oppressed," as though their collective experience was more difficult than, say, the billions of people that Christians enslaved, exterminated, and turned into second-class citizens of their own countries. Christianity has gone through nothing even remotely comparable - unless you count what the Christians have done to each other.

[chrisd]

kierkegaard was danish?

[sam i am]

Perhaps not, but the fact that Christians are and have historically been history's most powerful and oppressive persecutors ought to give pause to the notion that "Christians know what it means to be oppressed," as though their collective experience was more difficult than, say, the billions of people that Christians enslaved, exterminated, and turned into second-class citizens of their own countries. Christianity has gone through nothing even remotely comparable - unless you count what the Christians have done to each other.

Really?

Unless you consider the Third Reich "Christian" (despite the fact that Hitler and the majority of the top Nazis who implemented WWII and the Holocaust were avid pagans, NOT Christians) or Stalin's pogroms as "Christian" or the Turks (Islamists) as "Christians" when they instituted the Armenian genocide or the "ethnic cleansing" in what used to be called Yugoslavia "Christian" or....etc. et al.

Where do you get your "...billions of people that Christians enslaved, exterminated, and turned into second-class citizens of their own countries?"

What are your sources and what are your tallies? Let's see how serious you are about putting up the facts to back your wildly overstated statement.

[Schmeltz]

Are you serious? All of the enormous empires established around the globe from the fifteenth to twentieth centuries were constructed under the auspices of Christianity by Christian Europeans. The legacy of colonial imperialism was the oppression and subjugation, if not extermination, for who knows how many people from the Americas to India. Twenty million people alone might have died in the transatlantic slave trade that drove huge portions of the mercantilist world economy for hundreds of years.

There's never been a historical development or movement to rival that. If you want sources may I suggest consulting any volume on world history - the Times Atlas of World History is periodically reissued and is usually concise as well as insightful, you might start there. But it's all pretty common knowledge.

Furthermore, Christian Europe has been at war with itself almost continuously for centuries - the last fifty years are kind of an anomaly, and even they haven't been without trouble. A look at any history of the continent will tell you that.

This is all just finger-pointing anyway. The point is that oppression of any sort is really undesirable. Especially the religious kind.

[Ali]

i'll admit, i only have a casual knowledge of the history of modern israel, but my understanding of it goes like this:

allies win WWII and say "sorry about the holocaust, jews, here, have your holy land back"

and then the surrounding countries all go "no no no, this won't do, let's all invade them until they're dead"

only israel didn't die, it got strong, and paranoid.

again, i have a very casual understanding of the history, but i wasn't aware that israel immediately turned into an aggressor nation the moment it was born?
IT all depends on who's telling the story. Arabs say it was their land, not the Allies to give to Israel and then to arm and finance so that they could keep it. Israelis say it was theirs before the Arabs took it and they'll fight for it (with all these F16's and cluster bombs provided by Uncle Sam and his lapdog, than you very much).

The common element is Western do-gooding (aka oil-resource-securing).

Israel had better hope that the Middle East never runs out of oil - or that we never find another way to fuel cars, trucks, planes, etc - you watch how quickly the Military Assistance dries up when that happens.

[Tone Capone]

WEll , more so like understanding their reaction. Somebody would come in my house and didacte me to stay in the closet and then constantly wipping,humiliating me and hurting me, i would retaliate.

How are they suppose to act then....Just shut their mouth and do the carpet on the floor?

And please dont use the term "terrorists"....Or if you use it , apply it to both party. Israel are fucking terrorists too , dont forget that!

It's not their house. That land has been in dispute since people have lived there. Not only that, they have been given SEVERAL chances to live there in peace but the TERRORISTS don't let that happen. The TERRORISTS are letting the average Palestinian down. The problem in the middle east is the radical version of Islam that is being embraced by "people" willing to kill.

[baltogrl71]

Because it's xenophobic and fundamentalist.



Oh, well there's a rock-solid point in favour of your position. Try this for a comparative statement: the Jews all have to go, because how else will the Third Reich be established? There is no difference between the two questions.

I was kidding in a way on that one.

I appreciate that your identification with Israel is probably well-founded and very personal, but if you ask me Zionism is as toxic and ignorant an ideology as Islamism. I know a few Jews who are not Zionists by any stretch of the imagination and who are open-minded enough to criticize Israel when criticism is warranted, instead of mounting the feeble defense of messianic eschatology.

Here is the diffrence, I don't think they should be wiped off the face of the earth.I don't think only jews should live in Israel, tons of others live there peacefuly I may add.And I certainly do not wish any person believing in another religion harm, I honor their beliefs and only want the same for my religion.

Perhaps not, but the fact that Christians are and have historically been history's most powerful and oppressive persecutors ought to give pause to the notion that "Christians know what it means to be oppressed," as though their collective experience was more difficult than, say, the billions of people that Christians enslaved, exterminated, and turned into second-class citizens of their own countries. Christianity has gone through nothing even remotely comparable - unless you count what the Christians have done to each other.

As far as Christian oppression, HA what look right here in the grand old usa!

[sam i am]

This is all just finger-pointing anyway. The point is that oppression of any sort is really undesirable. Especially the religious kind.

On this we totally agree.

[fucktopgirl]

It's not their house. That land has been in dispute since people have lived there. Not only that, they have been given SEVERAL chances to live there in peace but the TERRORISTS don't let that happen. The TERRORISTS are letting the average Palestinian down. The problem in the middle east is the radical version of Islam that is being embraced by "people" willing to kill.


The radical version of islam has seen the day because of the oppression they suffer for a while. There is no average palestinians as they all suffer the same faith . And when you refer to Palestine receiving sevreal opportunities to make peace , are you talking about the 1947 deal were the arabs did get like 43% of tha land and the jews did get like 57%. And the better ground for agriculture and water was in wich camp you think?

There where supposed to be an internationalisation of jerusalem, this never happen , instead palestinians were put in refugiees camps.

Wander why they did not accepted this marvellous chance!

[yeahwho]

Check out our exclusive interviews with Bill Maher's roundtable guests.

This week: Israel's Benjamin Netanyahu

HBO was kind enough to let this extended interview from Real Time with Bill Maher on it's site. It's around fifteen minutes, but becomes riveting quickly. Give it a viewing and see for yourself how the Former Israeli Prime Minister thinks of the Jewish state today.

hbo linkage (http://www.hbo.com/billmaher/video/) Scroll down to interviews, it is the first selection in the bar.

They have quite an open and frank conversation on how the world percieves Jews throughout History and address Iran and the state of the middle east without restraint.

[fucktopgirl]

^^Oh my god..i freaking hate that prime minister!

What a piece of bullshit , lies and propaganda he just spilled out!

bill did ask some good questions but Netanyahu alsways detourne it and manage to blast islam on every opportunities.



LIES, LIes,lies....

Does the this interview can be found in a text?
Then i could rebute it , sooooo many things in there are just wrongs!

[sam i am]

^^^^

fuckedupgirl : are you a follower of Islam? Whence does your vitriol and hatred for Jews come from?

[fucktopgirl]

^^ I dont HATE jews !!

I hate/despised the government of israel for their tyrannic behavior!

I have the same feeling towards usa administration and any other country who cast suffering upon their fellow human being .


And , yea people that supports the cruel actions of their government are just part of this insanity too! So it can sionnists, americains, russian, german canadian.... i will point my finger at them !

[sam i am]

"any nation that cast suffering," eh?

Hmmm...

Who makes up nations and administrations again?

[fucktopgirl]

^ so.... your point?

[baltogrl71]

fuckhead girl you are full of hate and couldn't see the truth if it hit you in the eye.I feel bad for you, I do i really do. You are blinded by your hate which will limit your growth in life.

[fucktopgirl]

fuckhead girl you are full of hate and couldn't see the truth if it hit you in the eye.I feel bad for you, I do i really do. You are blinded by your hate which will limit your growth in life.


"yawn"

Oh well, that was really interesting, but you better be sorry for yourself instead!

You are just too much full of your own little constipated view, comfortable with fake security and materials rewards :you are not able to understand, feel compassion for the people that lives near that are suffering and are being subject to war crimes. YOu are the one full of herself ,hatred and prejudices, THoses blinders you wear blocked you from seing the truth and chaos that surround you. YOU bleat like a little sheep and following/accepting your government propaganda/lies , you should Be proud ! The fact that you support the israel state so therefore approving the actions they commited to achieved this goal prove that YOU are off the good path and not awake on the issue.

AGADOU PIS LACHE PAS LA PATATE!

[sam i am]

^ so.... your point?

My point is that "people," upon whom you devote so much empathy and sympathy and condescending "care" make up those governments. Why not have the same level of compassion for them?

[baltogrl71]

"When people criticize Zionists, they mean Jews. You are talking anti-semitism.”

Martin Luther King

[baltogrl71]

"yawn"

Oh well, that was really interesting, but you better be sorry for yourself instead!

You are just too much full of your own little constipated view, comfortable with fake security and materials rewards :you are not able to understand, feel compassion for the people that lives near that are suffering and are being subject to war crimes. YOu are the one full of herself ,hatred and prejudices, THoses blinders you wear blocked you from seing the truth and chaos that surround you. YOU bleat like a little sheep and following/accepting your government propaganda/lies , you should Be proud ! The fact that you support the israel state so therefore approving the actions they commited to achieved this goal prove that YOU are off the good path and not awake on the issue.

AGADOU PIS LACHE PAS LA PATATE!

I have never said a bad word about any other group of people, race, or other.You assume that to love Israel I must hate every one else, this is not the case. I am a peaceful loving person and I only want peace for EVERYONE. I also completely beleive in the right for Israel to exist.You claim I only see things one way, but you are such a subjective thinker and so full of rage you can't see the other side and be rational and that is what creates terrorist,

[Pres Zount]

"When people criticize Zionists, they mean Jews. You are talking anti-semitism.”

Martin Luther King

Well I guess Martin Luther King wasn't so great after all.

[baltogrl71]

"I cannot conceive of Israel withdrawing if Arab states do not recognize Israel within secure borders.”

Nelson Mandela

[fucktopgirl]

I also completely beleive in the right for Israel to exist.

WEll, yea they have the right to exist but palestine too! But they(israel and their usa partner) dont allow that.That why the creation of an Israel state is so erroneous: by vetoing and breaking internationals law , commiting war crimes over war crimes. The creation of this state is achieved by violations of basics humans rights and unjusts genocides and destructions of people habitations. There is no respect whatsoever in the process, that why you should not approve it. Shame on you !



You claim I only see things one way, but you are such a subjective thinker and so full of rage you can't see the other side and be rational and that is what creates terrorist,

HUmm , thinking is sujective in a way , nothing wrong with that. Thinking on issues mean that you search and study within your own frame of values and beliefs YOur truth while being objective at the same time and be able to have a good peripheral view on things.

I , for myself, Clearly see the other side of the conflict and that what alarmed me. INjustices and abuses of power are being commited by ISrael administration in their pursuit wich engaged a vicious circle of violence and suffering. And i dont think that laws and justice will see the day on the matter but sadly israel will realised their goal by killing more innnocents and pushing them away by invading was little is left to them(palestinians).


What create terrorist is the world politics/economics and the usa hegemony that is unfolding right now.

"In November 2004, a UN panel described terrorism as any act: "intended to cause death or serious bodily harm to civilians or non-combatants with the purpose of intimidating a population or compelling a government or an international organization to do or abstain from doing any act."[4]"


"The European Union employs a definition of terrorism for legal/official purposes which is set out in Art. 1 of the Framework Decision on Combating Terrorism (2002) [5]. This provides that terrorist offences are certain criminal offences set out in a list comprised largely of serious offences against persons and property which, "given their nature or context, may seriously damage a country or an international organisation where committed with the aim of: seriously intimidating a population; or unduly compelling a Government or international organisation to perform or abstain from performing any act; or seriously destabilising or destroying the fundamental political, constitutional, economic or social structures of a country or an international organisation."
All from wiki

HUmm, i think a alots of countries fit the criterias : The usa, Israel, england, russia and many more. BUT we safely can say that nowadays( since a while actually) the biggest terrorists around are USA.



Anyway, i will no longer waste my time by replying to you because you are so dense .

[sam i am]

HUmm, i think a alots of countries fit the criterias : The usa, Israel, england, russia and many more. BUT we safely can say that nowadays( since a while actually) the biggest terrorists around are USA.

There you go again....

Let's get a BIT of perspective...mmkay?

How about the genocide in Darfur? Rwanda? Human rights abuses in Myanmar? Bombings in Bali, London, Madrid, etc?

None of those are/were being perpetrated by the US. But, somehow, in your hate-filled, addled existence, the US & Israel are the two main pillars of what's wrong in the world. Says something about you, dontcha think?



Anyway, i will no longer waste my time by replying to you because you are so dense .

Talk about the kettle calling the pot black!

[fucktopgirl]

How about the genocide in Darfur? Rwanda? Human rights abuses in Myanmar? Bombings in Bali, London, Madrid, etc?

Your intervention is useless as i was only demonstrating that Being a terrorist is not a title that can only be attributed to the arabs world and that supermilitary power are the supreme terrorists in the present time and they do far more greater destruction then thoses little militias that are rebelling agianst oppression with slingshot.

None of those are/were being perpetrated by the US. But, somehow, in your hate-filled, addled existence, the US & Israel are the two main pillars of what's wrong in the world. Says something about you, dontcha think?

Again , i just say that thoses TWO supermilitary power are the ones creating a lots of shit nowadays, it is a fact and if you denied it, you are fucking retarded.

check their CV
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_military_actions_by_or_within_the_United_S tates
Almost every year they had military action all over the world. That how you build up a global military/economic/politic domination.



Talk about the kettle calling the pot black!

yep sam, how is it to see your reflection?

[fucktopgirl]

New deadly weapons?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1924524,00.html



"Due to operational reasons, the IDF cannot specify the types and use of weapons in its possession. In addition it should be emphasised that the IDF only uses weapons in accordance with the international law."

Hahaha, yea sure!

[sam i am]

Your intervention is useless as i was only demonstrating that Being a terrorist is not a title that can only be attributed to the arabs world and that supermilitary power are the supreme terrorists in the present time and they do far more greater destruction then thoses little militias that are rebelling agianst oppression with slingshot.

Hmmm.....

Millions dead in these "little militias," yet somehow the US and Israel are still worse? Tell that to those who have died in the Sudan...



Again , i just say that thoses TWO supermilitary power are the ones creating a lots of shit nowadays, it is a fact and if you denied it, you are fucking retarded.

Guess it's easy for you to say they're "creating a lots[sic] of shit nowadays.." without looking at the shit being caused by others, isn't it? Again, take your so-much-holier-than-thou attitude and eye and peer upon the injustices of the entire world WITHOUT looking only for loonatic conspiracies and US-Israel collusion....there's WAY more there than meets your one-sight-fits-all eye of perception.

check their CV
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_military_actions_by_or_within_the_United_S tates
Almost every year they had military action all over the world. That how you build up a global military/economic/politic domination.

You could do the same for nearly every single nation in the world and get similar results. Russia? Check...already schooled you on that one. France? Check...they've perpetrated and started more wars throughout history than almost any other nation. Etc., et al.


yep sam, how is it to see your reflection?

Oooooohhhh.....good one. What a comeback.:rolleyes:

Reflected glory is better than vainglorious attempts to rise above your obviously trash-strewn station in life.

[fucktopgirl]

Hmmm.....

Millions dead in these "little militias," yet somehow the US and Israel are still worse? Tell that to those who have died in the Sudan...

Yes, USA are the worst with their quest for global dominance!


Guess it's easy for you to say they're "creating a lots[sic] of shit nowadays.." without looking at the shit being caused by others, isn't it? Again, take your so-much-holier-than-thou attitude and eye and peer upon the injustices of the entire world WITHOUT looking only for loonatic conspiracies and US-Israel collusion....there's WAY more there than meets your one-sight-fits-all eye of perception.

Does your little pro-patriotic usa ego is touched?
Your country administration SUCKED and they polluated the world more intensely since 9/11 with the "war on terrorism", it is not preemptive war , it is preventive strike base only on "supposed" threat.

INdeed , there is a lots of conflicts happening in others countries, i never denied that fact.


Reflected glory is better than vainglorious attempts to rise above your obviously trash-strewn station in life.

"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence." --Einstein, Albert

[TimDoolan]

i'll admit, i only have a casual knowledge of the history of modern israel, but my understanding of it goes like this:
allies win WWII and say "sorry about the holocaust, jews here, have your holy land back"

This is commonly used as an argument by those who discredit Israel’s legitimacy by claiming that Israel was given to Jews by those who were guilty about the holocaust. The first Zionist congress occurred in 1897. The Jews fought for and recieived recognition for the right to establish a “Jewish national home in Palestine” from Britain in 1917 and from the League of Nations in 1922, two decades before the holocaust.

[Pres Zount]

The first Zionist congress occurred in 1897. The Jews fought for and recieived recognition for the right to establish a “Jewish national home in Palestine” from Britain in 1917 and from the League of Nations in 1922, two decades before the holocaust.
I don't really think that this fact does a good job of proving it's legitamacy. Judaism deserves a nation because Britain said so? Right.

[baltogrl71]

I don't really think that this fact does a good job of proving it's legitamacy. Judaism deserves a nation because Britain said so? Right.

you say this as judaism as a religon deserves I think this is part of the problem we are a race not just a religion.

In response to the canadian moron above who need not respond, I as most Jews and Israelis believe that palestine too has the right to exist and for her information the Israeli gov has ordered our army to protect th Palestinian Olive farmers, around many farms there are Israeli settlements where there has been conflict the farmers have been unable to take care of the trees for a long time the government recognized the unfairness and did something about it now there are many Israeli groups pitching in to help the palestinian farmers.Maybe instead of spreading your negativity you might try looking for stories llike this and you may even try spending your time trying to be positive and pointing out good things, it spreads just as easy as your hate.

[sam i am]

The Jews deserve a nation and the "Palestinians" deserve a nation.

The Jews have Israel, where, by the way, Arabs and Palestinians are CITIZENS in overwhelming numbers, while the Palestinians also have their own country : it's called Jordan.:)

[baltogrl71]

well if you look at it that way then a lot of American jews really support palestinians, monitarily, almost all of the clothes made for target(champion, mossimo,etc.) are made in Jordan.

[sam i am]

well if you look at it that way then a lot of American jews really support palestinians, monitarily, almost all of the clothes made for target(champion, mossimo,etc.) are made in Jordan.

The Jews have been supporting the Palestinians for milennia...why stop now?

[fucktopgirl]

The Jews deserve a nation and the "Palestinians" deserve a nation.

The Jews have Israel, where, by the way, Arabs and Palestinians are CITIZENS in overwhelming numbers, while the Palestinians also have their own country : it's called Jordan.:)


YOU are wrong....

Israel does not belong to the jews more then to the palestinians. IT belong to both!

[Pres Zount]

Why does Judaism deserve a nation?

Because they claimed it? It's the same incorrect reasoning behind the occupation of Northern Ireland, you can't just settle an area with overwhelming odds, then claim rights to a nation because of those overwhelming odds.

[sam i am]

Why does Judaism deserve a nation?

Because they claimed it? It's the same incorrect reasoning behind the occupation of Northern Ireland, you can't just settle an area with overwhelming odds, then claim rights to a nation because of those overwhelming odds.

Why can't you? Throughout history it's been that way and will probably continue to be. Unless someone stops them with force, all the talk means nothing.

[Schmeltz]

I was actually going to say the same thing last night before my internet connection went down - the fact is, people do that all the time. Whether or not it's a good idea is what's really up for debate. In the case of Israel - probably not a good idea, but we're stuck with it now.

[sam i am]

I was actually going to say the same thing last night before my internet connection went down - the fact is, people do that all the time. Whether or not it's a good idea is what's really up for debate. In the case of Israel - probably not a good idea, but we're stuck with it now.

Holy crap, Schmeltz! You actually agree with me on something!

Is the apocalypse nigh?;) :p

[Schmeltz]

Well I'm not sure about hell, but my hometown is pretty much frozen over.

[sam i am]

Well I'm not sure about hell, but my hometown is pretty much frozen over.

Welcome to winter...only 1 1/2 months early this year!

Guess global warming hasn't reached Canada :p

[fucktopgirl]

http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=1323449152


A rabbi explaning the difference between judaism and zionnism..

INteresting!

[fucktopgirl]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1944158,00.html


"In Jerusalem, the Israeli prime minister, Ehud Olmert, said a "technical failure" was to blame for the strike before dawn on Wednesday in which several artillery shells hit houses in a residential street in Beit Hanoun."


hahaha technical failure, what next?

[sam i am]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1944158,00.html


"In Jerusalem, the Israeli prime minister, Ehud Olmert, said a "technical failure" was to blame for the strike before dawn on Wednesday in which several artillery shells hit houses in a residential street in Beit Hanoun."


hahaha technical failure, what next?

Round up the Palestinians and start herding them through gas chambers?:rolleyes:

[baltogrl71]

Round up the Palestinians and start herding them through gas chambers?:rolleyes:


I am sure she stands with the president of Iran on this one, everyone lied about it another jew conspiracy.l

[sam i am]

I am sure she stands with the president of Iran on this one, everyone lied about it another jew conspiracy.l

Yep.

The Jews during WWII really WANTED to be rounded up into ghettoes, worked to death, sent to gas chambers, and then conspired to make-believe it all happened:rolleyes:

[Humiliation]

I cannot believe i will repeat myself again!

Sorry, there is a difference at the moment...The zionism are the ones invading and taking land, ressources and islamism are the ones defending and reacting to this confrontation . The rebellion movement that has been created among the muslims communities is in response to the zionism invasions and persecutions.

Are you in a state of oblivion?

The philosophy is the major difference between the two!
Didn't the Palestinians willing sell the land the ydidn't want to Israel? Then Israel made use of it? Don't quote me but i heard it from my history teacher when we were talking about it

[Pres Zount]

Yep.

The Jews during WWII really WANTED to be rounded up into ghettoes, worked to death, sent to gas chambers, and then conspired to make-believe it all happened:rolleyes:
you do realise that nobody is insinuating that the israelis be gassed, and that nobody was talking about the holocaust?

Pathetic attempt to gain some ground.

[Humiliation]

this argument is way too biased. Candadian chick you are obviously only looking at the information that supports your view. It's like michael moore movies, no right winger is ever going to watch it except in the case that they try and debunk it.

and zionist person, if you want peace so much why do you support a jewish state? it is one of the longest lasting conflicts in modern history and has ruined the lives of many. I don't call invading an entire country and blowing shit up with weapons supplied by the US to try destroy a terrorist group holding back much. Israel has a terrible history of overdoing it and taking revenge instead of diplomacy.

On the flipside palistine blows themselves up on buses full of innocent civilians and prossibly (usually) children. If they were truly innocent as canadian chick seems to think they are then they should be doin something constructive in stead of blowing themselves up to kill people who weren't connected with their oppression.

I'm too lazy to edit it

[sam i am]

you do realise that nobody is insinuating that the israelis be gassed, and that nobody was talking about the holocaust?

Pathetic attempt to gain some ground.

It's obvious that sarcasm as a tool of discussion is beyond the ken of your feeble-mindedness.

It was a follow-up joke meant for baltogirl, not you, Pres.

Follow the chain of posts before posting next time and pathetically attempting to "gain some ground" at my expense, please.

[Pres Zount]

Either you were using sarcasm to draw attention to the absurdity of someone saying that the jews wanted the holocaust to happen (which nobody did say) or you were using sarcasm incorrectly.

[fucktopgirl]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6187282.stm

Oh well, that is some new developpments!

I am wandering if actually this ceasefire will stay for more then a week?

and this

"Mr Olmert spoke of releasing many long-term Palestinian detainees in Israeli jails, lifting restrictions on the occupied territories and ultimately creating a viable state."


How this come about anyway? I miss a piece of the puzzle here, anyway i guess overall it is a good new for the palestinians people, now they can room around without fearing to be shot in the head....can they?

I am sceptic a bit ..will see


A suivre!

[sam i am]

Either you were using sarcasm to draw attention to the absurdity of someone saying that the jews wanted the holocaust to happen (which nobody did say) or you were using sarcasm incorrectly.

Fuckedupgirl asked what was next and I sarcastically replied. Baltogirl chimed in and I continued the ridiculous insinuation for the sake of continuing the sarcasm.

You don't get out much, do you?

[DroppinScience]

Guess global warming hasn't reached Canada :p

It reached us last year, but ever since Al Gore solved global warming with his movie, it's back to being fucking cold this November. :rolleyes:

[sam i am]

It reached us last year, but ever since Al Gore solved global warming with his movie, it's back to being fucking cold this November. :rolleyes:

Did Al Gore solve it or just blow enough hot air to obviate it?:confused:

Love that global warming when I wake up to 20 degrees farenheit here in Vegas and we have NO major hurricanes all season long. Kinda deflates the wind in his sails, eh?

[Pres Zount]

Fuckedupgirl asked what was next and I sarcastically replied. Baltogirl chimed in and I continued the ridiculous insinuation for the sake of continuing the sarcasm.

You don't get out much, do you?

Your comment stands out as misplaced, you 'continuing the sarcasm' doesn't make sense in relation to the context of what anyone else had said, sarcastically or not. AND I"M DONE.

[sam i am]

Your comment stands out as misplaced, you 'continuing the sarcasm' doesn't make sense in relation to the context of what anyone else had said, sarcastically or not. AND I"M DONE.

Glad you're done. I must have really tweaked ya.

It does make sense and others whom I have asked privately have agreed.

AND I'M DONE ***** slams door on way out while throwing hissy fit ****

[Pres Zount]

It didn't really, but I'm too standofish to leave it well alone.

[fucktopgirl]

^ you guys are getting distracted from the subject,just saying!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6158409.stm

Wow..i mean she will really make a difference , that is for sure! And she is damn ugly too but that not relevant here still..

"But she will also press him to redouble his efforts to form a new Palestinian government that accepts Israel's right to exist."

What about palestinians rights to live??

And form a new government but why?

[Tone Capone]

^ you guys are getting distracted from the subject,just saying!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6158409.stm

Wow..i mean she will really make a difference , that is for sure! And she is damn ugly too but that not relevant here still..

"But she will also press him to redouble his efforts to form a new Palestinian government that accepts Israel's right to exist."

What about palestinians rights to live??

And form a new government but why?


I bet you are wild in bed... :D (y)

[fucktopgirl]

I bet you are wild in bed... :D (y)

Well, i did not have sex for a while , so i bet i could do damage but...i dont see the correlation of your sentence with the subject at hand!!

[Tone Capone]

Well, i did not have sex for a while , so i bet i could do damage but...

I hear you loud and clear;) ;)

[sam i am]

It didn't really, but I'm too standofish to leave it well alone.

That's probably for the best.....if all we had to read was Tone's and Fuckedupgirl's flirting, I'm sure I'd fall asleep.

[fucktopgirl]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7195459.stm
18 january
and the shit go on and on. They were suppose to take a break with the annapolis peace talk :rolleyes:

OLmert continue his bloody colonialism expansion. But, that right, hamas send some rocket...so they had to retaliate

''The Israeli military has intensified operations in Gaza this week, killing at least 32 Palestinians, most of them militants, in air strikes.''

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7192260.stm
16 january

another one

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7188807.stm
15 january

I think the rocket from gaza did not kill anyone..

So what the fuck!!?? And now they blocked humanitarian help ...it is an unbearable situation. And nothing can be done, people who got the power are the one doing the dirty action , nobody can force them to stop because THEY are the king and they are backup by the USA who ''own the world'' like said Chomsky.

:(

[Tone Capone]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7195459.stm
18 january
and the shit go on and on. They were suppose to take a break with the annapolis peace talk :rolleyes:

OLmert continue his bloody colonialism expansion. But, that right, hamas send some rocket...so they had to retaliate

''The Israeli military has intensified operations in Gaza this week, killing at least 32 Palestinians, most of them militants, in air strikes.''

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7192260.stm
16 january

another one

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7188807.stm
15 january

I think the rocket from gaza did not kill anyone..

So what the fuck!!?? And now they blocked humanitarian help ...it is an unbearable situation. And nothing can be done, people who got the power are the one doing the dirty action , nobody can force them to stop because THEY are the king and they are backup by the USA who ''own the world'' like said Chomsky.

:(


sup girl? ;)

[fucktopgirl]

Not much peanut!!

[fucktopgirl]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7201757.stm

''A spokesman said the blockade, which has provoked widespread international criticism, was being lifted only for a day and would be reviewed after that.''

How nice of them, really...

'' Earlier, a warning from Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert that life would not be "pleasant or comfortable" for Gazans as long as rocket attacks continued prompted UN officials to join the EU in accusing Israel of "collective punishment".''

Collective pushiement, and unfair treatement and wrong accusation.

If Israel stop his fucking colonization and stop fucking bombing palestine, maybe they will stop trowing little rocket.

The media is full of corruption man, Israel are powerful son of a bitches.

[Carlos]

Lol... classic thread..

A lot of ground covered, just like to add a couple things into the mix.

Interestingly Israel as we know it only came about due to a terrorist campaign waged by the Stern Gang. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lehi_%28group%29)
With leading members going into the IDF, the Knesset and even one making Prime Minister in the 80's.
When in power the IDF carried out many massacre's and forced mass migration: kinda like Bosnia.

However, as with anything and everything there are responsibilities, and accountability. This is why I hold Israel largely responsible: It must start from the top - in other words the state should AT ALL TIMES FOLLOW LAW - and as the UN sets international law, then all states should uphold them. Israel is by far the largest serial breacher of international law, been flouting it for decades, from illegally possessing nuclear armmaments to occupying a country for nearly 40 yrs.

As for those deluded and filled with hate palestinians that launch rockets, where is the accountability, clearly the palestinian authroties however, not even the UK, or US has enough police to stop ignorant youths getting into trouble and wasting their existence - cos in the slums of palestine, there isn't fuck all to do except chuck things at your oppressors, ad occupyers - or watch ya pal do it. So the tiny security force - there are no police; Israel won't allow it - essentially spends it's whole time protecting the government of Hamas/fatah, from mossad assasinations (another of Israels long running illegal habits) - although they obviously didn't think they would go for the Hamas leader's son, both of them, and succeed in recent months. Imagine if any other state just killed both sons of another states prime minister -- fucking unbellievable. Or from each other now.

No hope, no future breeds discontent, and dissolution of the basic ideals that most people have: not to kill others, not hate. That goes for the UK, US, palestine, wherever.

It really isn't rocket science, the Israeli government are clearly not stupid (slightly demonic perhaps..), they know the more they squeeze, and press (which goes down well in the right wing press) it will do exactly what we saw last year with palestinians fighting each other........... also the obvious lash back at Israel - but seeing as it's tin cans vs laser guided apache hellfire, don;t think the government of Israel is too bothered - ok so they may kill an Isreali settler every 6 months, so they splash out on a few cruise missles, roll out the tanks, and the press is happy again, that's all it boils down to - maintaining political strength; i.e power, there is no threat from the palestinians to ther power so it is very little interest, but the press is. Same throughout history, under the auspices of religion, governments/establishments have used it to control people (Romans prime example).
No difference here - handy way for a group of people - who show very little in the way of spirituality - to maintain control over one of the most important regions on the planet, at the blatent expense of another race. Look at all the 'major' players in the world, Russia, china, US, etc. as well as many others.. the sole overriding principle, when you really analyse and boil it down is to maintain their control and power.. from small scale corruption, to mass hypnosis like in N. Korea, to the dog shit level of enquiery that is the american media.. LMAO. But religion still works a few places.

Bottom line, people are people, and yes can be held accountable, but a STATE cannot wage war of another state on the basis of what a handful of people in that state does. This is exactly what is going on in palestine - Isreal is punishing daily a whole race, because of a handful of that race.

It should, and does know better.. BOTTOM FUCKING LINE.

[dugmatics]

This is exactly what is going on in palestine - Isreal is punishing daily a whole race, because of a handful of that race.



Are the Palestinians a race or a nationality? I thought they were a semitic people.

[Carlos]

well yeah not strictly a race - i.e black, or white.. more a tribe/group/and now nationality..

doesn't really detract from the point I was making.. that Israel is punishing and de-humanising a whole nationality/group/tribe because of a FEW people in the group.
and not because they are being directly threatened by the whole nation/group in the form of state aggression....

[fucktopgirl]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xB_-Bv_7Emo&feature=related

The woman in the interview said that Israel never killed civilians!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFnM8NKiFso

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5KvHB7_k-U&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4E4-RZ28j8&feature=related
How come Israel invade the Gaza, Is it not not supposed to be like palestinians refugee camps?



A report on Rachel Corrie dramatic death and on the palestinian situation

Here is part one from ten.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqGOikJlDn4

It is worth it .
A point of view from an orthodox jew.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2mTgq-jw8M&feature=related

[fucktopgirl]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJU0eeW7ufM&feature=related

Some facts about Israel, very illuminating.

[funk63]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJU0eeW7ufM&feature=related

Some facts about Israel, very illuminating.





Israel raped my mother, killed my children, and burned down my town!!















That video is full of shit.