Not hip.

[DandyFop]

So, yeah. I have been friends with this group of people for the past 3 years or so I guess...I met most of them because like every single person worked at the theatre box office place downtown. Many of them are in the "cool" (if that's even possible) scene of Salt Lake - you know, the ones in bands, or artists, the indie kids who are actually indie, blabla. The kinds of people Dorothy Wood hangs out with.

Even though I would consider many of them friends - two of the guys were my room mates at one time, in Chile one of them and I hung out every day, I've kissed many, etc., I have never ever really felt like I was in their little clique. Now much of this might have to do with the fact that most of them went to high school together, and that makes sense, I mean that's how it is with my friends and I. But it really bothers me for some reason, and I really wish it didn't. I'm pretty cool sorta. I like bad zombie movies and drunk badminton and dance parties, and almost all the guys in the group and I have the same interests as far as funny things go like sketch comedy n shit.

The dude I was just going out with was officially in their "group". Which was part of the reason I liked being with him (not the only reason by any means, but something superficial and dumb that I liked) - I felt like I was in the circle more now or some shit. Like they would call him and he'd say "oh I'm hanging out with Barb" and for some reason that made me feel validated. And now that we've broken up I've seen those guys like once, and I'm not sure if they are avoiding me because they don't want to get me and the ex in the same room to avoid awkwardness or something.

Why? I don't get it - I don't get why it bugs me and I also don't get why they won't let me in. A friend of mine has certainly not known them since high school and yet she gets to be in the clique. If I start wearing headbands or reading more literature will that guarantee me the coveted Hollywood square spot? Whenever I had parties at my old house, it was unknown if they would officially "rock" or not, it was as though one of the cool kids had to put their blessing upon the party and then suddenly it would be okay to come to it (but only if one of their other friends was not having a party).

It also bothers me that I feel like their lives are more exciting than mine and shit. It bugs me that my friends won't go on camping trips and get stoned, or that they don't find it fun to stay up untill 5 a.m. dancing to shitty music and kissing everyone in the room. I realize how utterly adolescent this all is, you know, and I'm very embarrassed to even admit to feeling like this. This is not a thread to plead with you to tell me I'm cool - I know I'm okay, but I'm more like a real dork than a cool dork. And not even a smart one, just like a pop culture dork. I'm not sure I'm making much sense. I also feel like if I was more attractive to them that they would let me in more...like if i was the skinny girl who wore thrift shop jeans and shit.

This is fucking long and most of you won't read it. Meh.

Oh and I don't think I have made this thread before but if I have I apologize...it's just been bothering me lately.

[Schmeltz]

I don't get why it bugs me


Because you're really insecure? I dunno.

[Waus]

I thought this was going to be about TAL. :(




Oh, but I did read it too. I dunno...I can't pretend like I have real advice.
It seems to me like some people feel the need to be invited to things and get called, and other people just don't think about it and they start stuff. Maybe to feel more welcome you just need to be more like the second type?

I haven't the slightest. I feel like I need to be called a lot of the time. I wish I was more of an initiator.

[DandyFop]

Because you're really insecure? I dunno.

Well obviously insecurity is part of the problem. But I'm a fairly confident person when I want to be (maybe it's not shown here, but I tend to post more about my weak points/when I need an outlet, etc.).

Anyway, thanks for the brilliant insight.

[Kid Presentable]

So, yeah. I have been friends with this group of people for the past 3 years or so I guess...I met most of them because like every single person worked at the theatre box office place downtown. Many of them are in the "cool" (if that's even possible) scene of Salt Lake - you know, the ones in bands, or artists, the indie kids who are actually indie, blabla. The kinds of people Dorothy Wood hangs out with.

Even though I would consider many of them friends - two of the guys were my room mates at one time, in Chile one of them and I hung out every day, I've kissed many, etc., I have never ever really felt like I was in their little clique. Now much of this might have to do with the fact that most of them went to high school together, and that makes sense, I mean that's how it is with my friends and I. But it really bothers me for some reason, and I really wish it didn't. I'm pretty cool sorta. I like bad zombie movies and drunk badminton and dance parties, and almost all the guys in the group and I have the same interests as far as funny things go like sketch comedy n shit.

The dude I was just going out with was officially in their "group". Which was part of the reason I liked being with him (not the only reason by any means, but something superficial and dumb that I liked) - I felt like I was in the circle more now or some shit. Like they would call him and he'd say "oh I'm hanging out with Barb" and for some reason that made me feel validated. And now that we've broken up I've seen those guys like once, and I'm not sure if they are avoiding me because they don't want to get me and the ex in the same room to avoid awkwardness or something.

Why? I don't get it - I don't get why it bugs me and I also don't get why they won't let me in. A friend of mine has certainly not known them since high school and yet she gets to be in the clique. If I start wearing headbands or reading more literature will that guarantee me the coveted Hollywood square spot? Whenever I had parties at my old house, it was unknown if they would officially "rock" or not, it was as though one of the cool kids had to put their blessing upon the party and then suddenly it would be okay to come to it (but only if one of their other friends was not having a party).

It also bothers me that I feel like their lives are more exciting than mine and shit. It bugs me that my friends won't go on camping trips and get stoned, or that they don't find it fun to stay up untill 5 a.m. dancing to shitty music and kissing everyone in the room. I realize how utterly adolescent this all is, you know, and I'm very embarrassed to even admit to feeling like this. This is not a thread to plead with you to tell me I'm cool - I know I'm okay, but I'm more like a real dork than a cool dork. And not even a smart one, just like a pop culture dork. I'm not sure I'm making much sense. I also feel like if I was more attractive to them that they would let me in more...like if i was the skinny girl who wore thrift shop jeans and shit.

This is fucking long and most of you won't read it. Meh.

Oh and I don't think I have made this thread before but if I have I apologize...it's just been bothering me lately.

I read every word. It's perfectly normal to feel like this. You shouldn't look to 'cool' people to validate your own coolness, though. My mum validates mine. :)

[Drederick Tatum]

I'm basically like the coolest person my mum knows.

[Audio.]

y'ur not cool...

[DandyFop]

AH BALLS NOW EVERYONE KNOWS!!!!!!!!!!!!

But yeah my mom really does this I'm neat :/

Not literally, I'm actually a real slob.

[Dorothy Wood]

my mom likes to say, "YOU THINK YOU'RE SO COOL!" when we get into fights. it makes me real mad and I usually cry. ha ha. one of the times maybe 4 years ago it was because I called her "dude" on the phone while she was lecturing me and she flipped. :rolleyes: "I'M NOT ONE OF YOUR BUDDIES! YOU NEED TO GET A JOB! ARE YOU DRUNK?!" :( I was drunk. ha ha.


anyway, yeah, I know some cool kids...but really they're not that amazing or interesting. the ones who seem the coolest from the outside are usually pretty boring. I went to a dinner party attended by some ultra-cool people once and it was soooo boring. I mean, one guy was pretty locally famous, but everyone kinda just sat around quietly and made awkward conversation...or no conversation. everyone was really shy.

people just get used to eachother...that cool group is just as insecure as anyone, and can be just as dorky...they just somehow don't appear so. they depend on eachother for their coolness. usually it'll be like one or two people that start a party and the rest of the group just feeds off of that. that's why they all have to go the same party.

when I semi-dated that rockstar dude, I went with him to the drummer's house to watch a video they just made, and the drummer is like fuckin' hot hot gorgeous, very styled, ultra hip. model hot. anyway, everyone hanging out there sucked. they were total dorks. they looked good but they were not funny, not witty, nothin! I was like, "ew, really?" half the time my rockstar was arguing with his brother about whether or not one of them said "fuck" in front of their grandma 5 years ago. :/


I'd much rather hang out with goofy people and do fake french accents and give piggy back rides. humor is what brought me together with my closest friends (of varying levels of "cool"). I tried to make the leap to ultra-land, but it was too much work with not enough pay off. surround yourself with people who make you happy, not because of the validation they give you, but because of how much fun you have.

I dunno. modern life is for the birds.

[cosmo105]

ugh totally get you on all fronts. i have a lot of friends from different cliques in high school that have gone on to do super cool!! :cool: shit like working as djs in really famous clubs here and being models and getting written about in magazines all the time and being in super-respected art rock bands that are getting interviews all over the place...and i've never really been all that close with all of them. at one point, i was - and i decided i didn't want to be an art student and i didn't really like how, well, phony they all were. i know it's cliche, but it was true. i stopped being the one that would try and hold on to the friendships because they were too cool to call back or invite me to do shit. i'm really, really happy with the small group of loyal friends that i have now - with whom i don't even necessarily have all that much in common, but they will go to dinner with me and come to my birthday party and i can call them my true friends.

my point is, i used to really think i wanted to be friends with these cool people because it would mean i was pretty rad and people would want to be like me and shit. but then i realized i'm just not that kid. i'm not too cool to get way too excited about things that i like. (and i just can't get into some of that shitty music, regardless of how cool it would make me look.) if i step back and look at myself - i've got some awesome things going for me, and fuck it, i'm happy. people don't name-drop me, and i don't go to clubs on the weekends. i knit and watch tv with my boyfriend at my (pretty clean and un-hip) apartment and work really hard in school toward a career. that's what i really care about. not that they might have better clothes than i do.

curse you dorothy!

[TOY]

I guess I've been in the same boat.. In ways. IN (the) WAVES! Har, har. :cool:

But seriously... Over the years (I sound old), I've grown to be more comfortable with myself and have found if you're comfortable, you begin NOT to give two shits about other people and their scene or cliques. In highschool, a lot of it just got really stupid and repetitive for me. I found that in my solitude, along with ytmnd, and LiveJournal, and drawing shitty comics sort of, uh, was of benefit. I still get a little down/UNcomfortable sometimes and think gee - wow! That could be ME meeting some crap-ass local band drinking a 40oz. on MySpace default. But then I remind myself that the majority of these people, my once said HIGHSCHOOL friends, have all become carbon copies, and the CLOSEST of friends I've now (though very few) are DIFFERENT, and NEAT, and stuff. It's nice to have that variety. Because who needs to watch Eternal Sunshine for the hundredth time?

I guess what I'm TRYING to get at is, you know, fuck 'em. You're your own, unique fluffy/healthy-haired self. Let these people come to you. And if they don't LIKE you, or do not ACCEPT you, they can shut up.

A clique is just that. It clicks. It fits inside that little piece of plastic --a child safety-belt type of thing. See! Keyword! PLASTIC! Nowadays, who wants to fit in? People strive so hard to be different, so take advantage of what you already got.

[b i o n i c]

what they said ^^^


did everyone take smart pills yesterday? that makes two useful reads

[Tompz]

you sound like fun

[bigblu89]

I don't get why it bugs me

Because you're young and "being cool" is still a priority in your life.

Wait a few years, and you'll laugh at them just as much as I laugh when I read about Sarky's friends.

[abcdefz]

Sometimes if I'm envious toward someone who seems just too hip, I just pause and think, "Would I really rather be that person than me?" and the answer is almost unvaryingly "no." But maybe that person has more friends or goes to more parties or whatever, but they're almost always things I wouldn't want to do anyway.

Wanting connection is a powerful thing, but I'm not willing to abandon my self or my interests so I can fake it and be invited over for the Super Bowl game or go see Talledega Nights or go to a strip club or whatever. I'm just not interested. Yeah, I'd do some of that if it were a compromise, and they compromised by hitting up a museum or going with me to see The Queen or whatever, but I don't usually find that happening.

It's great when people are hip and interested in intellectual pursuits, though, and in those cases, I fit in pretty well. Maybe not the first one picked for the team, but a valued member.

[abcdefz]

Thanks. I have real life friends, too, just not that many.

And the Beta Band lines just played:

It's a Tuesday night and I can't be
With the people that I love tonight
They left me all alone and I can't forgive them
I guess I'll be on my own
I tried to see it their way
I tried to be alone
I tried to do my own thing
But the trouble with your own thing is
You end up on your own



...sounds very familiar.

[Dorothy Wood]

Because you're young and "being cool" is still a priority in your life.

Wait a few years, and you'll laugh at them just as much as I laugh when I read about Sarky's friends.


always got a put a little dig in there...even when what I responded with was totally sensible.

[cosmo105]

i find myself telling myself i want to go to these wild and crazy house parties/shows that an acquaintance of mine throws, but i'll find a reason that i'd rather stay home. it's not like anyone there would be sad that i didn't show anyway.


to be completely, brutally honest sarky, the way you describe your friends kinda sounds exactly like those people. :(

[Dorothy Wood]

maybe, but the ones who are my good friends aren't phonies. they're making good stuff and they're appreciative of the support they get. it just kinda worked out that some of us are fairly cool-looking.
they don't exclude people based on how they look, they exclude based on how people act. I mean one girl was starting to be a part of our friend group and everyone thought she was from ireland. she had an accent and everything, and talked about it a lot. and she was cool and super nice...but it turns out she was a fake. she lived in ireland for like two years, when she was in her early 20's. uhhh, so yeah, booted. because that's some serious lying fakery right there. fake irish! what a jerk!

I suppose maybe you're thinking of the "I love you" and hugging business, but I think that most of it's pretty genuine. I mean, none of us see our families that much because of where and how we live, so there's a need for physical affection from a makeshift family I guess. there's some elitism going on for sure, but it has more to do with brainpower than outfits.

[paul jones]

just call all your friends Big Smelly Cunt Faces(y)

[DipDipDive]

I pretty much don't have any friends. Shallow people and stupid people suck on equal levels, and I find it really hard to connect with people because I tend to learn pretty quickly that most of them fall into at least one of those categories. I'm either a snob or horribly insecure. Probably both.

[cosmo105]

*high five*

[Schmeltz]

It is natural that one's disposition be affected by different styles. But it is vulgar and foolish to look down upon the ways of one's own district as being boorish, or to be even a bit open to the persuasion of the other place's ways and to think about giving up one's own. That one's own district is unpolished and unsophisticated is a great treasure. Imitating another style is simply a sham. ... What things a person should be able to accomplish if he had no haughtiness concerning his place in society!


- Yamamoto Tsunetomo

[DandyFop]

Thanks for everyone's input. It's been interesting to read a few different perspectives.

I should clarify though that for the most part, most of these people are fairly genuine, good, cool folk, which is why I would like to be closer with them. I am sure I put them on a pedastal a bit, like rawk stuuurs, but all in all my experience is that they are decent peeps. I of course love my friends but I also wish that they were more...adventurous I guess? So it's not that I find myself wanting to hang out with douchebags, I want to hang out with people I find neat-o.

FREE CORN!

[ScarySquirrel]

Sorry, I have nothing to add that hasn't already been said.

But, I think going to a museum followed by the strip club sounds like an awesome idea. a-z, let's hang out, man.

[abcdefz]

But, I think going to a museum followed by the strip club sounds like an awesome idea. a-z, let's hang out, man.



If you can handle the airfare, I'll pick up all the rest except any extra-lapdancerous fees you incur.

[ScarySquirrel]

I'll be in California sometime in August. Permanently. So watch yourself, son.

[abcdefz]

Yeah? Did you decide to go to that sound engineering school?

[ScarySquirrel]

Eh, still thinking about that one... I need to investigate the place first and see what exactly I'm looking at for that, but I'm strongly considering it.

I just gotta get out to the L.A. area. Small towns are driving me crazy and I hate snow... plus when I went to L.A. it just seemed right. As stupid as that may sound, I dunno, man.

So, I'm gonna give 'er a go, try and get a "real" job out there once I graduate from here, and find out about getting that second thing from the sound engineering place.

[abcdefz]

Eh, still thinking about that one... I need to investigate the place first and see what exactly I'm looking at for that, but I'm strongly considering it.

I just gotta get out to the L.A. area. Small towns are driving me crazy and I hate snow... plus when I went to L.A. it just seemed right. As stupid as that may sound, I dunno, man.

So, I'm gonna give 'er a go, try and get a "real" job out there once I graduate from here, and find out about getting that second thing from the sound engineering place.



Well, good luck, sir.

L.A. is quite a ways away, but you're more than welcome in San José. Just give me some notice. There's an airport about two miles from my place, or I have plenty of parking. (y)