Please Remember how bush's presidency started

[kaiser soze]

With terrorists attacking our country while he read a childrens book. He was never hustled out of the room for fear of being attacked (why not?) but rather sat in a room rather peacefully (knowing full well he was safe?) placing the faculty and children in harm's way as well.

Soon bush will be gone but the damage is done. From enemies within and outside our borders, bush's failure to lead has led our country to where it is now....on the edge of a stinking shit hole (exactly where bin laden wanted)

bush failed to protect and failed to bring the culprit to justice. he failed miserably - steal, plane, must?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5WztB6HzXxI&eurl

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KlWSv0NZBRw&feature=related

[kaiser soze]

Another piece of shit to tag onto bush's legacy, his unfettered raping of the Environment and the catastrophe it has wrought

http://watthead.blogspot.com/2009/01/scenes-from-environmental-disaster_02.html

http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/01/02/tennessee.sludge/

http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/12/31/tennessee.spill/

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28461910/

[JayJayFuntime]

Go back listening to music....dude - lighten up.

9/11 wasn't an "inside" job. Bush did the appropriate thing on 9/11....even Obama will attest to this.....

If you want to be "enlightened" - if you truly are LIBERAL - you don't have so much hate.....c'mon dude....that's called socialism - and socialism always fails....hate gets you nowhere.....

Why not make a LIBERAL State? Acceptance? Bush would be fun to have a drink with - but lead a Nation - that was OUR fault....and we're DONE with it now....

Just don't hate so much dude.....it accomplishes nothing....

[saz]

socialism always fails? no wonder why canada has been so deplorable in recent memory, what with all of those balanced budgets and effective governments, being fiscally responsible while providing universal healthcare, a strong social security net and social programs. i guess too that western europe, and in particular france, sweden and norway should be written off as well as utter failures, what with their higher standards of living and all.

[AceFace]

^ i <3 sazi.

[kaiser soze]

Go back listening to music....dude - lighten up.

9/11 wasn't an "inside" job. Bush did the appropriate thing on 9/11....even Obama will attest to this.....

If you want to be "enlightened" - if you truly are LIBERAL - you don't have so much hate.....c'mon dude....that's called socialism - and socialism always fails....hate gets you nowhere.....

Why not make a LIBERAL State? Acceptance? Bush would be fun to have a drink with - but lead a Nation - that was OUR fault....and we're DONE with it now....

Just don't hate so much dude.....it accomplishes nothing....

I guess you don't know much about the bush family and their legacy

There is a long list of bullshit this admin has put this country and the international community through. There should be no forgiveness.

[JayJayFuntime]

DUDE - I'm from TEXAS!!!! I know....trust me - and I agree. I just don't want to get on that level - next thing you know we might want to go kick his arse and look for WMD! See? Let's just bring it back down to Five Feet From Earth - and relax with the new administration coming in.....only a week away.

As for Canada having a better system - as with Europe. I'm not knocking them - or saying we're better or greater than they are - but when statistics show their is an INFLUX of Americans pouring into Canada or Europe - then you can talk. We're still the most highly sought Nation on Earth for our democracy and the advantages it brings to the individual....you could always look for an Ant Colony to join - eh?

[D_Raay]

The reason there isn't an influx of people flooding to these places is that, unlike here, you can't simply waltz into another country and take up residence. They don't have jobs for people picking fruit or washing cars or doing dishes because their systems are set up to make these decent paying jobs with some security, not bend over backward so the rich can exploit these jobs.

[saz]

As for Canada having a better system - as with Europe. I'm not knocking them - or saying we're better or greater than they are - but when statistics show their is an INFLUX of Americans pouring into Canada or Europe - then you can talk. We're still the most highly sought Nation on Earth for our democracy and the advantages it brings to the individual....you could always look for an Ant Colony to join - eh?

sorry, but your argument doesn't make any sense. you were knocking socialism but now you're backpeddling. now you're attempting to link migration and immigraiton statistics to your case. in regards to your democracy and the advantages it brings to the individual, well, those very hackable diebold voting machines and supreme court decisions placing presidents into the white house certainly aren't helping the cause either.

[DroppinScience]

socialism always fails? no wonder why canada has been so deplorable in recent memory, what with all of those balanced budgets and effective governments, being fiscally responsible while providing universal healthcare, a strong social security net and social programs. i guess too that western europe, and in particular france, sweden and norway should be written off as well as utter failures, what with their higher standards of living and all.

Not to get all technical, but are Canada and other European nations really examples of socialist countries? Yes, there's certainly some aspects borrowed and integrated from socialism that are part of the Canadian and European systems. And with the case of Norway and Sweden, isn't it better described as "social democracy"?

Oy, is there a political science major in the house?

[saz]

yeah that's what i meant. socialism these days really is spoken of in the same regard as social democracy. bernie sanders refers to himself as an independent socialist senator, but what he champions is social democracy.

[JayJayFuntime]

Socialism - Democracy - either way - if it's perverted with and by the human interference of corruption and greed - which is inevitable - it's wrong.

America is feeling the effect now from greedy politicians and business models where the top wage earner receives a $50 million dollar check while laying off half the workforce.

Sorry if you misunderstood my intentions.....but we're on the same page....or closer than I've come across....sorry!

[kaiser soze]

I agree that hating bush is a waste of energy, but bringing him to justice would not be.

I guess in the meantime we can enjoy this mess of a final press conference.

(n)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUJABsrF0v0&eurl

[Carlos]

9/11 wasn't an "inside" job. Bush did the appropriate thing on 9/11....even Obama will attest to this.....

LMAO... yeah sitting there for another 20 minutes reading My Pet Goat was defo the right move when your country was under it's biggest attack ever.... but it's amazing how a couple of shoes obviously is a far greater threat than a possible jumbo jet crashing into a school - did you see how fast the secret service moved when some size 10's were hurled in his direction? :rolleyes:

[kaiser soze]

Of course sitting in a grade school was the best thing bush could have done.

The children would have magically stopped a plane crashing into the school!

I love bush's excuse why he didn't politely and briskly remove himself from the classroom. "It might have startled or frightened the children!"

But yet....he had his cute little press conference concerning the events moments later with the children as his backdrop.

(n)

[kaiser soze]

I'm sure bush will forget but we won't

http://www.pensitoreview.com/images/photo-buprsh-stpranding-on-flag.jpg

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/theblog/BushFlag2.jpg

[Carlos]

1 other interesting annomoly...

Bush stated that he watched the first plane hitting the WTC in the limo before getting to the school, paraphrase: "I watched the plane hit and thought, what a bad pilot..."

- but there was no footage of the first plane strike until much later that day :rolleyes:


.. easily put down to him talking shit, but SHOULD be put to him in impeachments trials of him and Cheney!

[yeahwho]

1 other interesting annomoly...

Bush stated that he watched the first plane hitting the WTC in the limo before getting to the school, paraphrase: "I watched the plane hit and thought, what a bad pilot..."

- but there was no footage of the first plane strike until much later that day :rolleyes:


.. easily put down to him talking shit, but SHOULD be put to him in impeachments trials of him and Cheney!

08:46:40:/ First plane has impact on the north WTC tower

8:48:08:/ The very first television report of an incident at the World Trade Center is broadcast locally in New York by WNYW less than two minutes after the plane crash into the North Tower. WNYW breaks into a Paramount Pictures movie trailer for Zoolander with the first live TV pictures of black smoke coming from the North Tower, relayed by a WNYW cameraman at ground level. One of the station's camera crews already had been out on the street that morning for New York's mayoral primary election. As WNYW broadcasts the first live pictures of smoke, the voice of reporter Dick Oliver is heard from the scene: "Jim, just a few moments ago, something believed to be a plane crashed into the South Tower of the World Trade Center." WNYW reporting would eventually correct the location of the first plane crash from the South Tower to the North Tower.

8:49:34: The first network television and radio reports of an explosion or incident at the World Trade Center. CNN breaks into a Ditech commercial at 8:49. The CNN screen subtitle first reads "World Trade Center disaster." Carol Lin, the first TV network anchor to break the news of the attacks, says:

"Yeah ... This just in. You are looking at obviously a very disturbing live shot there. That is the World Trade Center, and we have unconfirmed reports this morning that a plane has crashed into one of the towers of the World Trade Center. CNN Center right now is just beginning to work on this story, obviously calling our sources and trying to figure out exactly what happened, but clearly something relatively devastating happening this morning there on the south end of the island of Manhattan. That is once again, a picture of one of the towers of the World Trade Center."

8:55: President George W. Bush is at Emma E. Booker Elementary School in Sarasota, Florida as part of a scheduled visit to promote education and the Bush administration education policies when presidential advisor Karl Rove, who is with Bush, informs him that a small twin-engine plane has crashed into the World Trade Center. Before entering the classroom, the President speaks to National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice, who is at the White House. She first tells him it was a twin-engine aircraft—and then a commercial aircraft—that had struck the World Trade Center, adding “that’s all we know right now, Mr. President.”

[Carlos]

er... black smoke is not A PLANE which is what he said he saw..

there was NO footage of the first strike until hours later that day..

[Carlos]

....We're still the most highly sought Nation on Earth for our democracy and the advantages it brings to the individual....


just wanted to thank you for making me laugh so hard it hurt - sorry to break that bubble, but "don't believe the hype" as they say....

Lets hope Obama really does change things for good - health care, foreign poilcy etc.. and America realises it's been conned into it's current socio-polictical paradigm for who knows hong long.

[yeahwho]

er... black smoke is not A PLANE which is what he said he saw..

there was NO footage of the first strike until hours later that day..

I see your point, but when bush said, I saw the "plane hit" with his low IQ and 0 grasp of correct phrasing (he is a convenient hick for the idiots who voted him in) he obviously meant "plane hit story". I was and so were millions of people in shock at this point of the story, it was fubar.

I do not think it is an impeachable offense to be in shock. Within a year though a pattern of abuse, lies and bullying began.

[kaiser soze]

What is a leader when those you lead are worse off than before you becamse their leader? bush failed....miserably. A legacy of nothing, quite possibly negatives upon negatives. The U.S. should rethink this man's deeds and his untouchable status. Millions are imprisoned for offenses 1/100th the damage to society this man has wrought.

Why wasn't this a massive story?

Oh....couldn't have ANOTHER Fucking huge disaster under bush's belt...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZhT4jx2XZ8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtJVSwdfEZ0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3i-gzhW10WA&feature=channel

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PgjVEA79CWg&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZsZ9A9h2SA0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bkF67ixAPw&feature=channel

[Carlos]

I see your point, but when bush said, I saw the "plane hit" with his low IQ and 0 grasp of correct phrasing (he is a convenient hick for the idiots who voted him in) he obviously meant "plane hit story". I was and so were millions of people in shock at this point of the story, it was fubar.

I do not think it is an impeachable offense to be in shock. Within a year though a pattern of abuse, lies and bullying began.

er.. there's no mis-contruing 'what' he said:

He said yesterday: "I saw an airplane hit the tower - the TV was obviously on - and I used to fly myself, and I said, 'There's one terrible pilot.' And I said, 'It must have been a horrible accident.'"

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2001/dec/05/september11.usa

but as I said, 'could' be as simple as him lying - seems to come very easy to these guys. BUT the contradiction needs to be investigated along with the dozens of other things that just don't work with the official account.


Bush's and by extention Cheney's legacy is that of fear, ignorance, aggression, and deceit. This we KNOW - just how far did that go we need to find out!

[yeahwho]

er.. there's no mis-contruing 'what' he said:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2001/dec/05/september11.usa
but as I said, 'could' be as simple as him lying - seems to come very easy to these guys. BUT the contradiction needs to be investigated along with the dozens of other things that just don't work with the official account.

And who is going to investigate this? I'm not quite too sure why you think I'm at some polar opposite of you, unless, of course, the train of thought your entertaining is 9/11 conspiracy.

It is pretty common knowledge in the United States that George W. Bush can barely grasp the English language. We've had a running gag her daily for the past 5+ years called "Great Moments in Presidential Speeches (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoNVOH9ygNM)".

That is a dead end approach to impeachment.

A much better approach is starting a war with Iraq on circumstantial evidence.

[kaiser soze]

I read somewhere that bush could be impeached post-term. This would essentially wipe him of all benefits president's receive after leaving the office.

If I were Obama, I would look into it. Obama and the Democratic congress has inherited Iraq undoubtedly and will bear the blame for generations unless they prove who is at fault (granted congress has been sucking neo-con dick for a few years)

[Carlos]

.....unless, of course, the train of thought your entertaining is 9/11 conspiracy.

lol ... are you really sayin 911 was carried out by 1 person???!!! :confused: ...otherwise by definition it is a conspiracy between more than 1 person.

Emotively labelling certain accounts 'a conspiracy theory' means fuck all. What is of importance is whether the account holds up to scientific, and logical scrutiny - even the documented official 'accounts' contradict each other let alone the scientific and logical problems they throw up.

Iraq, Gitmo, patriot act - none would of been acceptable if there was no 911 - it's what these guys asked for PNAC doc: in order to get back dominance of the middle east and invade Iraq the progres would be slow, unless there was.. "some catastrophic and catalysing event like a new Pearl Harbour.", and they were lucky enough for it to happen a year into term.

Thing is Yeahwho, we've been round the block so many times on this subject, and every time you, and others on this board fail to address details, and facts - but rather fall back on your belief system - which is inherent in your attitude that I might, just might be entertaining the idea that there's more to it than we've been told - in other words your mocking me for being objective. :rolleyes:

For example - rather than you being able to accept that when Bush said he saw a plane hitting, he actually meant to say he saw a plane hitting - which is the only thing you can possibly take from the quote, you make it to be something completely illogical in relation to the quote, and lazzily put it down to him not being able to string two words together.... which I am fully aware of, but makes no sense in relation to the whole quote.

as I said before:

Bush's and by extention Cheney's legacy is that of fear, ignorance, aggression, and deceit. This we KNOW - just how far did that go we need to find out!

[yeahwho]

I don't lived in fear here in Seattle or in cyberspace. My family and friends have continually signed petitions and all are very vocal about the impeachment of Bush and Cheney.

I have no fear of paranoia about the way I live nor does anyone I know. I'm not going to defend anybody who sticks to youtube style investigations of the events to 9/11. Those are real dead people who died on 9/11, with real families. When you venture into that arena it better be something earth shattering as opposed to the unadulterated fantasies I've seen perpetuated on the internet.

You can toot the 9/11 conspiracy theory till the cows come home, congress will not hear it, Bush will not be charged for it. It is the strangest lamest most incredibly naive way to start an impeachment process, by sabotaging the facts of Al Quaeda. They are.... real.

[kaiser soze]

bush may be gone but his legacy has left some lasting scars

That pig will not be able to run from history, it will find him and show our future generations who he was and what he never was.

[Lyman Zerga]

even as an american i wouldnt have voted for him

[kaiser soze]

a very low legacy

egged from the start

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAp6YAPtC2c&eurl

leaving the place in a wheelchair

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEl-y-7iKos&eurl

[ToucanSpam]

Not to get all technical, but are Canada and other European nations really examples of socialist countries? Yes, there's certainly some aspects borrowed and integrated from socialism that are part of the Canadian and European systems. And with the case of Norway and Sweden, isn't it better described as "social democracy"?

Oy, is there a political science major in the house?

Bitches don't know about Cuba. It's a little socialist republic off the coast of Florida. Those who say socialism doesn't work should probably read about Cuba. Real books, not internet sources from Wikipedia or CNN. Real books!

I'm no poli sci major, but Canada is a parliamentary democracy that is also technically a monarchy. There's absolutely NOTHING socialist about our political structure. However, due to the rise of the welfare state during the late 1920s and 1930s, Canada has a tendency to be concerned with the welfare of its people. Hence the universal health care system, unemployment programs, etc. That I suppose would be "socialist" if it requires a label.

[JayJayFuntime]

Nah Elmo - why not go to South Florida and talk to many, many CUBANS who risked their LIFE to come HERE. Socialism I guess just didn't work for them - eh? Maybe they should rent Mikey Moore's good movie.....

Every country that has Universal Healthcare also BITCHES about it....where is the incentive? What Dr. is going to double their workload for half-price?

Why not FREE MEDICINE? Wanna help the people - make prespricption costs FREE. Oh - that's right - the pharmaceutical companies are in ALL back pockets - even Obama's.....

Lowering standards for everyone to help a few doesn't solve anything. Create a FREE-MEDICINE state and that will go a long way to acheiving UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE everyone can ENJOY.

Or, look at it this way....

The Europeans historically have been FIRST trying everything - and then we take it, twist it and make it our own......but first you must find a politician who will offer FREE MEDICINE...that won't hurt the dr's - just the hot chicks who sell overpriced, pimped out asprin for $8 a pill....

[ToucanSpam]

Nah Elmo - why not go to South Florida and talk to many, many CUBANS who risked their LIFE to come HERE. Socialism I guess just didn't work for them - eh? Maybe they should rent Mikey Moore's good movie.....

Every country that has Universal Healthcare also BITCHES about it....where is the incentive? What Dr. is going to double their workload for half-price?

Why not FREE MEDICINE? Wanna help the people - make prespricption costs FREE. Oh - that's right - the pharmaceutical companies are in ALL back pockets - even Obama's.....

Lowering standards for everyone to help a few doesn't solve anything. Create a FREE-MEDICINE state and that will go a long way to acheiving UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE everyone can ENJOY.

Or, look at it this way....

The Europeans historically have been FIRST trying everything - and then we take it, twist it and make it our own......but first you must find a politician who will offer FREE MEDICINE...that won't hurt the dr's - just the hot chicks who sell overpriced, pimped out asprin for $8 a pill....


FREE MEDICINE will never exist in a capitalist system, if you mean medicine that is produced by companies at no charge. Do you mean maybe a government run company that produces medicine for free?

[saz]

Nah Elmo - why not go to South Florida and talk to many, many CUBANS who risked their LIFE to come HERE. Socialism I guess just didn't work for them - eh? Maybe they should rent Mikey Moore's good movie.....

Every country that has Universal Healthcare also BITCHES about it....where is the incentive? What Dr. is going to double their workload for half-price?

while i'm sure people complain about virtually everything, the incentive with universal healthcare and coverage is that ordinary people can receive very crucial and life-saving surgeries, procedures, transplants free of charge. a family member of mine recently had to undergo major surgery. it didn't cost us a dime. but if we were american, or if we did not have a universal system in place, we would not have been able to afford such a procedure. in fact, more than one of us would had to have made serious financial sacrifices, ie putting up our homes etc.

cuba is a communist state, a totalitarian communist state. you're confusing a communist government with successful and appreciated social democratic policies, such as universal healthcare.

the point moore was making in sicko is that even a communist state such as cuba even has a much more fair, humane and effective healthcare system than america's private-for-profit system, which results in 18,000 (http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/healthcare/2002-05-22-insurance-deaths.htm) americans dying each year due to lack of coverage.


Lowering standards for everyone to help a few doesn't solve anything.

universal healthcare involves anything but lowering standards. with universal systems, you're not denied care because you can't afford it.

[DroppinScience]

Bitches don't know about Cuba. It's a little socialist republic off the coast of Florida. Those who say socialism doesn't work should probably read about Cuba. Real books, not internet sources from Wikipedia or CNN. Real books!

That's overly simplistic to say that the Cuban example "works." Despite being under a cruel embargo for about 50 years, yes Cuba has managed to accomplish LOTS to their citizens (health care, education, literacy campaigns, etc.), but there are a lot of shortcomings, such as food shortages and the stifling of dissent and free speech. No, Cuba is not quite the "evil empire" the neo-cons would have you believe, but Cuba isn't the utopia those on the New Left would have you believe, either. It's somewhere in the middle.

[ToucanSpam]

That's overly simplistic to say that the Cuban example "works." Despite being under a cruel embargo for about 50 years, yes Cuba has managed to accomplish LOTS to their citizens (health care, education, literacy campaigns, etc.), but there are a lot of shortcomings, such as food shortages and the stifling of dissent and free speech. No, Cuba is not quite the "evil empire" the neo-cons would have you believe, but Cuba isn't the utopia those on the New Left would have you believe, either. It's somewhere in the middle.

I agree completely, I wasn't trying to suggest Cuba is without problems. However, people tend to automatically assume since the USSR failed that all communist states in the history of humanity fail miserably, etc. When I bring up Cuba they deliver CNN-based facts and assume the country is going to go to shit the second everyone named Castro dies. The truth is there is healthy support for Cuba to continue running the way it is now for a long time!