"Cassette playa: in praise of tapes"

[FunkyHiFi]

"Cassette playa: in praise of tapes" (http://www.factmag.com/2010/07/26/cassette-playa-in-praise-of-tapes/)

It’s no secret that the cassette is enjoying a renaissance in underground music culture; an enduring staple of the global noise and industrial scenes, the cassette has since become the favoured medium for a whole new generation of artists, from “hypnagogic” psychedelicists to bedroom pop eccentrics.......Both the CD and its bastard spawn, the mp3, have made convenience the priority, but at the expense of factors crucial to the consumer’s identification with recorded music. Music was first disassociated with imagery, and its tangibility reduced, with the mass abandonment of vinyl in favour of the CD. Then it was disembodied, made ethereal, and had its fundamental connection to its author ruptured with the arrival of the mp3.

There's also a partial listing of artists who have released albums on cassette in the last year.

An MP3 can sound very good IMO as long as its encoded at a decent bit rate, say, at least 192kbps and using a good encoder like LAME. And btw above that rate, many people can't tell the difference between that and the CD, even on a quality home component system.

But......analog tape in general does add its own special "sonic personality" to a music signal - do a search on "euphonic" for more details on this - which is why more & more artists are transferring their digitally-recorded music to analog tape (usually reel-to-reel) then back to digital, which is accurate enough to retain most of the warmth of the magnetic particle recording technology.

New cassette decks are difficult to find - I think Pioneer (http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Products/HomeEntertainment/AudioComponents/CassettePlayers) and Onkyo (http://onkyousa.com/prod_class.cfm?class=Cassette) are the only companies still selling them. Used ones though show up all the time at garage sales and thrift stores (really old ones will probably need some work, for example cleaning dirty heads and replacing dried out rubber drive belts).

[JoLovesMCA]

WOW thanks for posting this. I am a bit old school and really miss the tapes and stuff. It was really interesting to learn how the underground culture still appreciates the tape. Never knew all of that about it. thanks again.

[TurdBerglar]

you can't compare cassette tapes to reel-to-reel. cassettes are the the basterdized versions of reel-to-reels.

cassettes have the sound quality of a shitty mp3


the only reason why these old cassette players would sound better than an ipod isn't because of the format(mp3 vs cassette). it's because of the hardware. ipods have shit hardware.

im not defending mp3's because they do sound like shit under critical listening. they just sound less shit than tapes if encoded at a decent bitrate.

there are mp3 players out there that have audiophile grade hardware and sound wonderful. just nobody knows about them because the ipod has flooded the market.

[FunkyHiFi]

you can't compare cassette tapes to reel-to-reel. cassettes are the the basterdized versions of reel-to-reels.I guess I don't remember the article mentioning that.

RtR was considered the highest quality home recording format ever, and many consider to sound even better than the vinyl format (prerecorded reels were available too, including in the quadraphonic surround format). But a good RtR was pricey and even more of a hassle to deal than vinyl. Here's one sold by one of the more highly regarded brands, a Technics RS-1520 (http://www.vintagetechnics.info/tapedecks/rs1520.htm) (can't see its classy wooden side panels though).

cassettes have the sound quality of a shitty mp3Portable cassette players definitely could and do sound crappy. The better ones though, in the $100+ range sounded pretty decent.

BTW if anyone gets hold of an 80s era Walkman or other brand, remember that the intenral parts have probably aged and that can negatively affect the sound quality. Plus, the heads can become magnetized, a common problem for any tape format.


OTOH home cassette decks can sound nearly as good as a CD player, if:

* the deck is decent quality, at least $200 (2010 dollars).
* the right tape is used - chrome type is the minimum
* recording levels chosen carefully
* heads aligned properly
* noise reduction used (unfortunately on cheap decks, NR systems almost always produce a dull top end)

And the best decks for all practical purposes flat-out sounded like a CD player, but they weren't cheap. In 1985 dollars that would mean spending at least $500.

I owned a Teac deck that cost me $180 in 1983 and it made tapes that sounded great in the car and pretty good at home. But a Harman/Kardon deck a buddy owned that cost him about $400 in '85 sounded a lot better.

FYI: the Nakamichi "Dragon" (http://www.naks.com/) (click on "NAKS"). was considered the best deck ever made. I think it came out in 1985. I remember going to look at it and when I finally saw it, thinking how friggin' BIG it was! Larger than many receivers sold at the time actually. One of it major hi-tech features was its microprocessor-controlled realtime head alignment system, which constantly monitored & adjusted the heads as the tape played(yes, lots of tiny gears in there!).

the only reason why these old cassette players would sound better than an ipod isn't because of the format(mp3 vs cassette). it's because of the hardware. ipods have shit hardware.
Yep the analog output stage i.e. hardware, has to be of a certain minimum quality, because no matter how good the source is - analog (tape or vinyl) or digital - if that output stage sucks so will the sound you end up hearing.


there are mp3 players out there that have audiophile grade hardware and sound wonderful. just nobody knows about them because the ipod has flooded the market.Two companies have been selling docks that bypass the iPod's analog output stage and go right to their digital source:

* Wadia (http://www.stereophile.com/digitalprocessors/1008wad/)
* Onkyo (http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/31/onkyo-nd-s1-ipod-dock-feaures-digital-audio-composite-video-an/)

So: with analog you get what you pay for plus it takes some fiddling with the gear to get it optimized. Digital? It's definitely easier to get good sound but you still have to work at it a little bit. :)

[FunkyHiFi]

WOW thanks for posting this. I am a bit old school and really miss the tapes and stuff. It was really interesting to learn how the underground culture still appreciates the tape. Never knew all of that about it. thanks again.It may sound weird, but like the article said, I also miss making mix tapes and listening to them and when you listen to them, you don't have the e-z track selection that's available with CDs and MP3 players so you're sort of forced to listen to all the songs, much like when playing a record. That may sound strange but it's sort of....calming....because CDs and digital files can cause you to act in sort of an A.D.D. manner since it *is* so easy to change tracks.

This is partly why so many concept albums (especially the ones w/tracks that segued smoothly into one another) came out starting in the late 60s and through the mid 80s, before CD started taking over.

[FunkyHiFi]

there are mp3 players out there that have audiophile grade hardware and sound wonderful. just nobody knows about them because the ipod has flooded the market.Actually right now I'm looking for a new player and am looking at brands like Creative's Zen series for example. They may not have the groovy commercials like the Apple people have the budget for, but their players still get good reviews. My little 1GB Sansa player has been good too and am also looking at their upscale models, probably around 8GB (I use my CD and dvd-audio players to listen to music when I'm at home. I also am planning on buying an internet tuner - no computer needed btw just a broadband connection - for my audio system to listen to all that free streaming music available on the net. Possibly this one (http://www.jr.com/revo/pe/RVO_MONDOWIFI/) This also allows you to hear music stored on your hard drive).

[TurdBerglar]

the problem with digital music isn't so much the the format.

when cd's first came out the record companies seemed to have a habit of not using the first generation master tapes. so these first generation CD's suffered from tape problems but had great EQ and dynamics. then when the second wave of remasters came out during the mid 90's and later they started to use the original master tapes but then they started to use shitty EQ and compressing the dynamics. apparently the average joe likes his music to sound boosted and distorted so the record companies obliged.

it seems overall the CD has never been given a fair shot at living up it's full potential. when the cd format is used to it's full potential it blows the old analog shit out of the water audio quality wise.

the average cd today sounds like utter shit. and it's purposely done to sound liek shit. because of this LP's are making a comeback because you physically can't do the same things to an lp that they do the cd's to make them sound like shit.

when i buy a new CD i look for a vinyl rip(like ripping a cd but with an lp) someone has done and posted online. because 9 times out of ten the vinyl sounds better than the cd because the record companies purposely fuck up cds.

[Guy Incognito]

i have a load of boxes full of tapes in the loft, not touched them for years. I dont really miss them. I dont miss rewindind and fast forwarding, i dont miss that wobbly sound they would make after repeated listens, tapes chewing up or getting pissed off when an album was over 45 mins long. Pain in the arse.

I do miss high speed dubbing though.

[abcdefz]

My last deck had Dolby C and also dbx noise reduction. These were great, but it made the tapes worthless if I wanted to take them anywhere,
so for a lot of favorite albums, I wound up with two copies on cassette.

The basic idea was buy a record, clean it and clean the turntable needle (I had a linear tracking turntable), pop in a good cassette and copy
the record. The record goes in an anti-static sleeve and back in the album which goes into a plastic sleeve. File it away and it only comes
back out for mix tapes.

8-track tapes, in theory, should have sounded better than cassettes but didn't. But for a time, I had an 8-track recorder as well.

Later, when I was recording songs, I had an 8-track reel to reel by Tascam, if I remember right. That was some good times.

[Documad]

When I was really young, my older brother had a reel to reel set up and loads of jazz music on it. I thought it was scary. I preferred vinyl.

Like A to Z, I used to have a high quality setup that allowed me to tape my vinyl onto cassettes. I got a much higher sound quality than on prerecorded tapes. I bought blank cassettes in bulk from my school. I used to type up the labels. I was nuts. I bought my walkman (except it was made by some other company) almost a year before anyone else in my circle. I ordered it out of one of my dad's tech magazines because they weren't sold in stores yet.

I don't miss cassettes. I hated having to fast forward and rewind the fuckers. There are loads of limitations in sound via ipod but the convenience is worth it to me. I can listen to vinyl at home when I need fabulous sound. I never listen to CDs at home.

It seems that every year, the masses care less and less about sound quality. We have access to amazing technology at the high end of the market but most people seem delighted to listen to music on crappy speakers.

[FunkyHiFi]

My last deck had Dolby C and also dbx noise reduction. These were great, but it made the tapes worthless if I wanted to take them anywhere,....Dolby C could help you make an excellent recording, but yea, few other people had that NR system on their own decks, and AFAIK no car decks had it.



I don't miss cassettes. I hated having to fast forward and rewind the fuckers.Please, tell us how you really feel. :D

I never listen to CDs at home.:eek: They're my main mode of music playback! "Perfect Sound Forever" you know. ;) If nothing else tears up my finances this year, I am planning on buying a nice CD-only player, probably a Yamaha or an Arcam.

It seems that every year, the masses care less and less about sound quality. We have access to amazing technology at the high end of the market but most people seem delighted to listen to music on crappy speakers.The sacd and dvd-audio formats are two formats with (technically) better sound accuracy than CD, but very unfortunately for them, they both debuted right before the iPod and cheap broadband came out, and were pretty much doomed from then on. Here's a long discussion (http://www.quadraphonicquad.com/forums/showthread.php?12110-DVD-Audio-backers-What-Happened) about the reasons for dvd-audio's demise (sacd shared many of those reasons btw), with many posts by someone ("jimby") who worked in that business, who I am 99% sure worked for Universal Music, which sold titles in both formats, Beck's Sea Change being one of them. Also, "Neil Wilkes" posts there and he was responsible for the mastering of the excellent King Crimson multichannel dvd-audio series (dvd-audio discs also include a 5.1 Dolby and/or DTS track for regular dvd players).

[FunkyHiFi]

it seems overall the CD has never been given a fair shot at living up it's full potential. when the cd format is used to it's full potential it blows the old analog shit out of the water audio quality wise.The small indie audiophile labels usually offer such CDs, but unless you're into classical or jazz, you're screwed and are stuck with what the major labels hand out. :( Not ALL their CDs stink, but nowadays it's really difficult to find the good ones.

.....LP's are making a comeback because you physically can't do the same things to an lp that they do the cd's to make them sound like shit.That's my opinion too, plus its a lot more of a hassle to copy an LP, even with one of those USB tables.

Speaking of vinyl, for no particular reason here's a video someone made of his 60s-era stereo console - weighing at least a couple hundred pounds! - playing a 45 of the orchestral version of "The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly" title theme (here's the better original (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZG1fmfZGuWw) - one of those cool "haunting" types of tracks. And a great movie!).

[TurdBerglar]

those king crimson dvda's are great

[TurdBerglar]

The small indie audiophile labels usually offer such CDs, but unless you're into classical or jazz, you're screwed and are stuck with what the major labels hand out. :( Not ALL their CDs stink, but nowadays it's really difficult to find the good ones.

That's my opinion too, plus its a lot more of a hassle to copy an LP, even with one of those USB tables.

Speaking of vinyl, for no particular reason here's a video someone made of his 60s-era stereo console - weighing at least a couple hundred pounds! - playing a 45 of the orchestral version of "The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly" title theme (here's the better original (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZG1fmfZGuWw) - one of those cool "haunting" types of tracks. And a great movie!).

audio fidelity and mobile fidelity sound labs offer what seems to be mostly classic rock or music from that era.

[abcdefz]

(y)Mobile Fidelity even put out some of the Firesign Theater's comedy albums on CD.

I remember buying Mobile Fidelity's half-speed mastered albums now and then. I know I had Born to Run and Imperial Bedroom... can't remember
what all else.

[The Notorious LOL]

This hipster throwback crap is getting obnoxious. Fuck cassette tapes.

[kaiser soze]

I'm rocking 8 track in my tightie whities

[FunkyHiFi]

This hipster throwback crap is getting obnoxious. Fuck cassette tapes.I don't think anyone here is advocating the return of the cassette format in any major way - I'm sure not - but rather, this is just a fun look back on a playback system a lot of us grew up with & that has some good memories connected to it.

And for any other audio gear geeks :D, the cassette system involved lots of buttons, different noise reduction systems & tape formulas, gears, motors, VU meters, yada yada yada so to them it can be an interesting format to work with.....but admittedly it's things like that that are also what helped to sink the format when recordable CDs finally appeared: if you didn't set the recording level just right, pick out a brand of tape most suitable for X deck's recording circuitry (yep deck manufacturers could be that picky), keep the heads cleaned/demagnetised, set the bias, etc etc. But despite all this, because of the way the format's complicated electro-mechanical systems behaved, you knew in the back of your mind that the tape you just recorded so carefully on your deck almost never would sound as good on another person's deck. :(

So while I think MP3 files are boring as far as using and/or creating them, I much prefer them over tape because if encoded at high-enough data rate (192kbps+) they sound so much better, plus they're much easier to use and can "carry" waaaaaaay more of them with me. CDs though are my format of choice at home, though pulling up a media player on the PC and hitting the random button is great for providing background tunes (there is wi-fi gear made to connect to component audio systems so you can listen to files & internet radio from your computer).

[abcdefz]

Don't forget four track cassette decks! I had a Fostex that was a blast. Also fun to record tracks bearing in mind that you'd be bouncing down and learning how to get the EQ right.

[b i o n i c]

what i loved about cassettes was the physical feeling of holding a plasic box with a finite piece of plastic line transmitting music. it was a much more tactile experience, interacting with music.

i miss the act of giving a friend a tape. giving someone a tape, not unlike knitting a scarf for a loved one.

actually handing your friend a tape was more like giving SOMETHING to a friend. something about sharing a list of links with an email list feels a bit less tangeable than it felt in the past, somethings missing from that old act of sharing..

so, yeah, tapes (y)

[FunkyHiFi]

A moment of silence - Sony has announced they will no longer sell the Walkman, the original portable cassette player.........

"Goodbye, Walkman - Sony is shutting down production of its revolutionary portable music player." (http://www.slate.com/id/2272288/)

Sony announced on Monday that it is shutting down production of the Walkman. Talk about ending with a whimper: Who knew that portable cassette players were still being made at all?

But, please, a little respect. As bulky, cheesy, and crude as they may seem in an age of iPods, iPads, and smartphones, the Walkman players were a revolutionary product—perhaps the seminal innovation in the popular culture of our time.................

BTW when portable cassette players were still popular, Sony (and some other companies) sold some models that were nothing like the plasticky stuff you see now: Dolby noise reduction, metal tape capability, electronic transport controls (small motors did all the work inside of moving the heads back and forth or switching between forward/backward scan, etc) and 100% metal cases that were barely larger than the cassette itself. For one of Sony's ultimate models, do a search for their WM-DD9, which had features most home decks only wish they had.

FYI: cassette players are still around in other forms, I think for uses like books-on-tape, like this classic form (http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2252670&CAWELAID=107600195) seen here. I guess the RS marketing people thought the idea of portable cassettes was just a fad - those young whippersnappers! :D - because they didn't start selling them until nearly four years later, in their 1984 catalog (http://www.radioshackcatalogs.com/catalogs/1984/) (page 42, click to enlarge/drag image) <---- awesome Flash-based site, all the way back to the 1940s, for other electronic and audio geeks to see how geeks in years gone by entertained themselves! :)

[FunkyHiFi]

actually handing your friend a tape was more like giving SOMETHING to a friend. something about sharing a list of links with an email list feels a bit less tangeable than it felt in the past, somethings missing from that old act of sharing..+1

[Sir SkratchaLot]

Check out this stuff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=088AWsTtTFU

[FunkyHiFi]

^ That's pretty cool.

Wouldn't be surprised if a DJ gear company came out with some kind of gizmo that attaches to the cassette tape hubs (instead of directly using his fingers?) so a DJ could have better control over moving the tape.

[stipemanblue]

I love me some cassette tapes. It would be awesome if people released their albums on cassette along with records and cds.

[dave790]

the best thing about cassettes and tape decks is mix-tapes utilising the pause button. from ages 12-15 i'd say it was a common hobby for me, and i still listen to them every now and again. not the best work, but great fucking fun.

[destructo]

i have a load of boxes full of tapes in the loft, not touched them for years. I dont really miss them. I dont miss rewindind and fast forwarding, i dont miss that wobbly sound they would make after repeated listens, tapes chewing up or getting pissed off when an album was over 45 mins long. Pain in the arse.

I do miss high speed dubbing though.

AMEN!

[brothermarco]

Hello, i agree audio tapes are the best.i have about 400 tapes some of them are over 40 years old. There are all in good state. i and luv them. Long live the boys.

[FunkyHiFi]

While they did have some issues, cassettes definitely had advantages over earlier portable music playback systems (http://www.flickr.com/photos/x-ray_delta_one/4665388030/). :D

btw that amplifier uses vacuum tubes, which is what everything electronic used before transistors came along in the early 50s, and many companies still sell vacuum tube-based audio gear.