Big British bands and how they are viewed in America

[redandwhiterob]

Just wondering how some of my favourite bands are viewed by the American public and how successful they have been over the states

Oasis
The Jam
The Smiths
Blur
Stone Roses

[EN[i]GMA]

Among "the general public", they only know Wonderwall and Song 2. They may have heard a Smiths song if they were old enough in the 80s, but it's doubtful.

Among Americans who know anything about music, we know about all of them.

If you went to an American football game and polled the crowd I'd be surprised if you got more than 5% of the people who knew who the Stone Roses were.

EDIT: That said, America is a huge country. All of these bands have, I'm sure, sold tons of records in America, possibly more than they have in England in some cases (maybe).

But only Blur and Oasis have any kind of "popular" name recognition. I imagine in Britain the Smiths and Stone Roses are at least names people have heard of, or heard a song from?

[Bob]

i think oasis was fairly popular for a while, wasn't it? i remember thinking they were boring and wishing they would go away when i was a teenager, but maybe it was just wonderwall.

[JoLovesMCA]

I loved Oasis in the 90's during high-school. I mean Champagne Super-nova and Wonderwall were all the talk. But then it sorta fizzled out. I think American distribution is sometimes more difficult for bands from other countries so at a certain point maybe they don't promote as much over here. America is so fickle too, one second we love you and the next we toss you aside and are ready for the next big thing. :/

[redandwhiterob]

How big a news was it when Oasis spilt in the American music press?

As you can probably guess it was pretty big news in the normal news channels over here never mind the music press

[Adam]

I didn't even know Oasis had split.

I used to love them as a teen to and then saw them live and yaaaaaaaaaaaaaawn!

[Guy Incognito]

^ first time i have heard someone say they were shit live. Seen them 5 or 6 times and they were impressive each time.
they got two big for their boots in the states, the tour where liam didnt turn up didnt help. they maintained this facade of not being bothered about breaking the states. I think if they'd give it a big push they would be enormous but i think they were unwilling to play the game to the fullest. Wouldnt kiss enough arse so to speak.

[Documad]

It's difficult to generalize about americans and what they know about music. It depends on who you're talking to. Are you asking a bunch of college kids or a bunch of random people on the street? I know a ton of people who won't have heard of any of those groups. You have to be Bruce Springsteen, a country superstar, or someone on reality TV to make a dent with the general public. Frankly, I don't know whether any of my friends can even name one song by Stone Roses (I can think of three people who would probably recognize She Bangs the Drums from college radio but I wonder whether they could name the band). I know people who are still obsessed with Morrissey though, so Smiths would do okay in a poll of my friends.

The funny thing is that no one will seem to be familiar with bands, and then you'll find yourself in a club with 1,500 people who showed up to see Travis. I'm constantly wondering where all the other people came from, because I never run into them outside of a concert.

[Adam]

I've been told that before about Oasis - that they've never known a bad gig. So it maybe me, it may of been a one off but I didn't enjoy it. It was at Sheffield Arena in about 97.

[redandwhiterob]

^ first time i have heard someone say they were shit live. Seen them 5 or 6 times and they were impressive each time.
they got two big for their boots in the states, the tour where liam didnt turn up didnt help. they maintained this facade of not being bothered about breaking the states. I think if they'd give it a big push they would be enormous but i think they were unwilling to play the game to the fullest. Wouldnt kiss enough arse so to speak.

Sounds like Noel and Liam that, is was either there way or the highway

[Documad]

Oasis was big on MTV for a while years and years ago because of TRL. I'd heard they were supposed to be a great live band in the UK, but there was no evidence of that in the US. As a result, I don't think they were every respected here. I never saw it as a matter of them being too cool to stoop to touring here. I always thought they chickened out because they couldn't live up to the hype. But maybe Liam and Noel were just fighting and there was no motive behind the screwed up live shows.

Funny thing: Since the last time we talked about this, I saw Oasis play to an US arena that was half empty despite the promotor practically giving away tickets (I think my ticket cost $15). The audience only seemed to know a limited number of songs. And Noel was actually quite good despite the bad situation. I thought he was charming in fact. Liam spent half of the time not on stage and I can't say that I missed him.

I think it's difficult for british bands to tour here. There is just so much diversity in tastes and audiences and venues. They could be the coolest thing ever in NYC and die the next night in another city.

[Adam]

I saw Marky Ramone about 2002, soon after Joey died. Did some Ramones covers with the UK Subs. Should of been the most awesome thing ever and only about 20 people turned up - they was good tho. The next night in Leeds apparently you couldn't get tickets for love or money and it was rammed.

I think it was a matter of bad publicity to but what Documad said can be true anywhere but a bigger scale in the states. Cus its bigger. So you have to scale up the problem.

[saz]

Stone Roses

the only band worth discussing in this list.

[Guy Incognito]

the only band worth discussing in this list.

very harsh. the roses are probably my favourite band but the rest on the list are some of the best stuff britain has produced.

the roses didnt really take off in britain let alone usa. they got close and blew it. up john squires nose by the sounds of it
oasis didnt crack america cos they were too big headed and shot their mouth off too much
the smiths and the jam wrote songs that were mainly about english/british things, not sure it would have fully translated. maybe a change in sound to crack america would have gone against everything they stood for in a way.

Blur is a similar story, at the time of their greates success they were probably to anglocentric and then when they started shedding that sound they did ok in other parts of the world. "Song 2" being a fairly universal hit but after that album their whole career dissapated over the course of two patchy albums

[redandwhiterob]

very harsh. the roses are probably my favourite band but the rest on the list are some of the best stuff britain has produced.

the roses didnt really take off in britain let alone usa. they got close and blew it. up john squires nose by the sounds of it
oasis didnt crack america cos they were too big headed and shot their mouth off too much
the smiths and the jam wrote songs that were mainly about english/british things, not sure it would have fully translated. maybe a change in sound to crack america would have gone against everything they stood for in a way.

Blur is a similar story, at the time of their greates success they were probably to anglocentric and then when they started shedding that sound they did ok in other parts of the world. "Song 2" being a fairly universal hit but after that album their whole career dissapated over the course of two patchy albums

Good post that mate and pretty much sums up all the bands mentioned in the OP

[yeahwho]

I like the Smiths the best of the bunch. The Smiths seemed to not care about mega-success and actually those songs are so relentlessly lamenting I can't help but love the Smiths for bringing up endless tales of woe.

Morrissey continued on in the same vein with mixed results that's for sure, but still he hits the occasional lightning and seems to be a very popular cult like figure in the states. Of all of those bands I like the Smiths the best, "There is a Light that Never Goes Out (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INgXzChwipY)" is still being covered by current local bands.

So many other Great bands not mentioned... many hit white hot then just vaporized, but they left a trail of great songs...

James
House of Love
Happy Mondays
Inspiral Carpets
The Charlatans
Suede
Supergrass
(My Beloved) Undertones (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oskM5XD_Yc4) (Are they Brits? if not, they should be knighted anyway)
Robyn Hitchcock

so many more I cannot think of off the top of my noggin' but yeah there's some brilliant art from the UK. I like all those bands and the majority I never even heard of until 2000 or so. I think the first time I heard a Smiths song was 6 years ago.

Oasis is sort of lame though, sorry just not one of my faves and I do have 2 of there albums.

[Guy Incognito]

^ some good bands on that list and Suede!

i think oasis get mentioned a lot because they were so huge, they stole the roses thunder and made guitar music massive again over here and it was expected they would storm the entire world and in terms of british bands being successful in US then they did achieve a lot more than most

[yeahwho]

Oasis is a very good band but their stature is not in the Beatles/Who/Stones/Zep arena, not even near such powerful music. Plus the band vibe always seemed as though there could be some sibling rivalry during the concert. Bickering is a death null to people going out for a concert.

Oasis has some fantastic music that actually eclipses some of their influences but like first album so accurately titled "Definitely Maybe" the output was inconsistent and each record had some real clunkers on them.

Does Oasis have a "Best Of" album? They have 12 great songs.

[Guy Incognito]

there are two. Stop The Clocks which came out about 4 years ago which is a 2cd anthology from all their singles albums and b sides.
And Time Flies - 94-09 which is a massive singles collection, i dont think its been out that long.

[Documad]

Does Oasis have a "Best Of" album? They have 12 great songs.

If you own two of their albums, chances are you already have the hits. Unless you bought the wrong two albums. :p

[silence7]

Oasis...... Meh...

The Smiths, Hell Yeah!

The Jam, YES!

The Blur.. NO

Stone Roses, Uh No..

But, I will admit to being a gen-x 80's music aficionado.

[Freebasser]

Stone Roses as bad as an 'uh, no' but Oasis only a 'meh'?

*slaps sense into you*

*BAM* (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FfzQLZtCZSY&feature=related)
*BAM* (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FuPfbfJm2rc)
*BAM* (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZy19QzqUKk)

[b i o n i c]

what would be the american equivalent of oasis? stone temple pilots?

[Guy Incognito]

^ what? melodic rock using lots of influences from the past. easy . foo fighters

[b i o n i c]

yeah but scott weiland is a dick in that american kind of frattish sort of way

[Guy Incognito]

whilst i am on the subject, i have something to say that is probably going to wind some up.

Noel gallagher gets lambasted for writing tunes that draw on big influences from the past and openly admits it and , in my opinion, does a good job of that for the most part. but he gets criticized for being unoriginal but Paul Weller gets away scott free with it all and is hailed as a genius. for the record i really like all his guises and he is brilliant but he is one of the biggest musical theives going.
Examples:

Start
A town called Mallice
The Changingman
Virtually all of the style council stuff
uh-huh oh yeh
Wild wood

beatles, motown, small faces , o jays, nick drake, if anyone hasnt made the connection. there are loads more but i cant be arsed.

I'm not saying he should be criticized for it but then dont criticize noel for doing the same and being a lot more open about it. winds me up.

rant over

[Guy Incognito]

yeah but scott weiland is a dick in that american kind of frattish sort of way

dont know what you mean by frattish? Liam is a big scally dickhead. but he can sing

[b i o n i c]

i dunno, like asshole tough guys that hang out at bars

[Guy Incognito]

i dunno, like asshole tough guys that hang out at bars

righto fair do's , i thought you meant studenty, which liam is not. Noel is a top guy, intelligent funny, makes good copy. liam is a birrova cock

[Planetary]

dont know what you mean by frattish? Liam is a big scally dickhead. but he can sing

no he can't, really. he's a good vocalist, but not a good singer

[Guy Incognito]

no he can't, really. he's a good vocalist, but not a good singer

he can sing oasis songs very well. he has a very distinctive voice. whether he could sing anybody else songs is debatable yes. so i agree. his brother knows him better than anyone and noels songs got the best out of him

[dave790]

no he can't, really. he's a good vocalist, but not a good singer

early years he you could say he had a good voice and was a good singer. well, he certainly gave it his all. later on i'd say gigs were a bitch patchier, but he's got a solid rock n roll voice nevertheless and as guy says, distinctive.

are depeche mode still big in the states? or is that just for over-30s/40's? i also remember bush doing well over there in the 90s.

[Lex Diamonds]

Oasis was big on MTV for a while years and years ago because of TRL. I'd heard they were supposed to be a great live band in the UK, but there was no evidence of that in the US. As a result, I don't think they were every respected here. I never saw it as a matter of them being too cool to stoop to touring here. I always thought they chickened out because they couldn't live up to the hype. But maybe Liam and Noel were just fighting and there was no motive behind the screwed up live shows.

Funny thing: Since the last time we talked about this, I saw Oasis play to an US arena that was half empty despite the promotor practically giving away tickets (I think my ticket cost $15). The audience only seemed to know a limited number of songs. And Noel was actually quite good despite the bad situation. I thought he was charming in fact. Liam spent half of the time not on stage and I can't say that I missed him.

I think it's difficult for british bands to tour here. There is just so much diversity in tastes and audiences and venues. They could be the coolest thing ever in NYC and die the next night in another city.
Big fat LOL @ the idea of Oasis "chickening out" of anything. And your idea that America is more diverse than Britain is 100% wrong, ignorant and slightly offensive.

Oasis...... Meh...

The Smiths, Hell Yeah!

The Jam, YES!

The Blur.. NO

Stone Roses, Uh No..

But, I will admit to being a gen-x 80's music aficionado.
I don't even know where to start with you... "The Blur"??

Idiot.


ps
Liam's one of the greatest frontmen of all time, but he's not even the best singer in Oasis, everyone knows that.

[Guy Incognito]

Big fat LOL @ the idea of Oasis "chickening out" of anything. And your idea that America is more diverse than Britain is 100% wrong, ignorant and slightly offensive.





ps
Liam's one of the greatest frontmen of all time, but he's not even the best singer in Oasis, everyone knows that.

not sure about chickening out but i think they bottled it in terms of not changing their approach at all. I mean thats kinda to be commended but they were never going to win everyone over in US with the way they went about it.

ps, you think noel's a better singer? he's good but his voice lacks something at times. i think liam could have sang everything noel actually sang whereas not sure that applies the other way around. I do like noels voice though.
legend has it that liam wanted to sing dont look back in anger and noel wanted wonderwall but noel thought that liam nailed the wonderwall vocal so took the other one. good decision all round.

[Lex Diamonds]

Yeah I definitely think Noel's a better singer. I'd say about 3 of my top 5 Oasis songs are probably Noel. Have you listened to the Unplugged sessions, where Liam didn't turn up so Noel played and sung everything solo? A couple of the songs sounded better with his voice, although I do admit Liam has that extra something in his vocals that makes him such a great frontman. Noel hasn't got that brash swagger, it's not his style. He's more laid back and sage, in my opinion he's pretty much a god.

[Guy Incognito]

Yeah I definitely think Noel's a better singer. I'd say about 3 of my top 5 Oasis songs are probably Noel. Have you listened to the Unplugged sessions, where Liam didn't turn up so Noel played and sung everything solo? A couple of the songs sounded better with his voice, although I do admit Liam has that extra something in his vocals that makes him such a great frontman. Noel hasn't got that brash swagger, it's not his style. He's more laid back and sage, in my opinion he's pretty much a god.

oh yeah, noel's a massive hero, he's on the dream dinner party list lets put it that way.
Noel does do the more meaningful songs justice and his voice lends it to that but in my opinion Liam can rock it with the best on some tunes(RNR star/Go Let it Out for starters) AND be soulful on others (Stop Crying Your Heart Out/Stand By Me) and sometimes both (Slide Away/Live Forever).

I remember watching that unplugged when it was first aired and being really pissed off liam didnt sing for a few reasons but yeah i still thought noel struggled with the rockier stuff but i suppose you could forgive him for the occassion and the fact his kid had let him down. I have never had any complaints with either voice on the several gigs i have seen.

I wish they had sang more together.

[Lex Diamonds]

This thread has inspired me to go and listen to some Oasis, cheers. Haven't heard any for a good while. They're probably the group (along with the Beastie Boys) that have had the most impact on my life/musical education as I grew up with them thanks to my older brother and the fact we lived in Manchester at the time they were coming up (my sister also forcefed me Blur, which I'm thankful for).

[Guy Incognito]

(y)

i'll post a favourite on here instead

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6tuPBrSl9Nw

[Caribou]

I was a huuuge oasis fan at about age 11. It was the first band I discovered by myself and I remember going to the library, getting all their singles and recording the B-sides onto a tape.
I listened to that tape even more than I listened to Definitely Maybe, which is an awful lot. And then when the tape broke, they released 'The Masterplan'.
It's ridiculous how many great songs are on that album, considering they were only B-sides.

And it depends on the song whose voice I prefer. Noel's voice sounds great with the quieter, ballady songs, whereas Liam has that sneer that's better for the rockier tracks (Though 'married with children' sounds utterly lovely when he sings it.)

I'm going to listen to it right now and think about the day they came to The Netherlands and I couldn't see them because I was too young and I cried and read the very first music magazine I ever bought for myself. <3

PS: I always loved this song http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbsSmp9bMvM

[M|X|Y]

has there been any conclusion to the question in the title?

[Guy Incognito]

I bought Supersonic without hearing it. I'd read a bit of the hype and i took the risk. Then i bought everything after it. The B-sides were awesome. Before them the Roses were the ones and they had great b-sides (and the shit backwards ones) but oasis's were even better. Some of them would have been number one singles (Acquiesce, Masterplan). I remember thinking things were losing quality when the b-sides for Be Here Now singles were a bit pants.

For the record, Noels voice sounds best on Half A World Away and Sad Song (Bonus Track on Def Maybe Vinyl for those who dont know it)

[Guy Incognito]

has there been any conclusion to the question in the title?

yes, they werent as big in america as they were in britain.

[Guy Incognito]

caribou, nice tune to link. I think Whatever is the best single overall.

Whatever
Its Good To Be Free
Half a World Away
Slide Away

[Lex Diamonds]

Married With Children, although not one of their best songs overall, is a perfect showcase for Noel's vocals. The line "your music's shite, it keeps me up all night" totally captures their swagger whilst remaining incredibly soothing. The song's a perfect close to a classic album.

I agree about Whatever, too. I remember stealing my brother's tape of it when I was about 7. Epic, in the true sense of the word. (y)

[Guy Incognito]

Married With Children, although not one of their best songs overall, is a perfect showcase for Noel's vocals.

errr.....?

he does it live well though (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeHnh-kT-L8&feature=related)

[Lex Diamonds]

Shit I don't know why but I thought he did the album version... it's been a while as you can tell. I know he wrote it about his ex-girlfriend though, maybe that's what confused me. Also, this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0FH6jrM59E) is prob my favourite version of it. (y)