View Full Version : Even Worse Than It Looks'?
yeahwho
05-23-2012, 05:52 PM
It's Even Worse Than It Looks
How The American Constitutional System Collided With The New Politics Of Extremism, a new book by Thomas Mann and Norman Ornstein.
An astute look at our current failing government process in the United States.
"One of the two major parties, the Republican Party, has become an insurgent outlier — ideologically extreme; contemptuous of the inherited social and economic policy regime; scornful of compromise; unpersuaded by conventional understanding of facts, evidence and science; and dismissive of the legitimacy of its political opposition," they write in their new book, It's Even Worse Than It Looks.
larger excerpt from book (http://www.npr.org/books/titles/151524728/its-even-worse-than-it-looks-how-the-american-constitutional-system-collided-wit?tab=excerpt#excerpt)
clip from ABC news, Norm Orstein (http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/power-players-abc-news/blame-party-washington-problems-102604505.html) in which he says Republicans are the party of obstructionists.
This board is proof of that, every republican response has been TROLL or bitch or eliminate, not one idea of action. To only promote elimination of government and proliferation of corporation powers is patently insane.
The republican party has lost me, completely.
Dorothy Wood
05-23-2012, 09:32 PM
When I was a kid, I figured adults were smart, my blue collar family was smart and well-spoken, my teachers were smart. Even when I went to a Christian school, people were tolerant, proud to be intellectuals, excited about science.
As I got older, I recognized that what I'd been taught didn't matter. The principal of a school where I taught sent out memos with tons of typos. She was a flake and an idiot...and the principal of a whole school! A teacher I once worked for put up a sign that said, "choice's". I guess I never realized when I got back my teacher certification test scores that being in the 99th percentile meant I did better than almost everyone, even though I didn't feel particularly smart...and barely studied.
Though I'm not a teacher anymore, I have the instincts to teach people, to understand all sides of issues clearly and communicate with honesty. And I have to remind myself that the majority of people do not come from that point of view. Which is really sad, because it's such a simple thing. I don't feel like it's hard, or that I'm special (mainly because most of my friends share my opinions). But then you see what goes on in the rest of the country and think, what the fuck happened?
yeahwho
05-25-2012, 04:41 PM
When I was a kid, I figured adults were smart, my blue collar family was smart and well-spoken, my teachers were smart. Even when I went to a Christian school, people were tolerant, proud to be intellectuals, excited about science.
Knowledge, working hard, and rational problem solving have become under-rated. When our leaders started to use "Crisis Management" and "Plausible Deniability" with more and more recurring incident, we as citizens followed suit. Our elected honorable leaders set the standard. For stupidity and lying.
People behaved better because there was a certain amount of respect and intolerance towards blatantly fucking each other over. We are now 5 years into an international economic slump (still on the verge of complete economic failure) and the genius idea Romney and the rest of the republicans have is "Less Regulation of Wall Street" and "Tax Cuts" for the wealthy to create jobs.
We had regulations and reasonable standards, practices in the banking industry so average American citizens were valued as customers not looked at as marks who's whole lifetime of hard work and value could be drained.
Now corporations are equal citizens with their own private unlimited campaign super pacs. How is that EVER going to work for average US citizens? (http://www.heraldnet.com/apps/pbcsi.dll/cceimg?Site=DH&Module=4100&Class=4100&Type=Cartoons&Date=20120524&ID=4548671&Element=1&MaxW=660)
abbott
06-21-2012, 06:31 AM
you know what say. Fuck the two party system.
The real issue is the the Republicans and Democrats have the same people pulling the strings.
yeahwho
06-22-2012, 12:49 PM
you know what say. Fuck the two party system.
The real issue is the the Republicans and Democrats have the same people pulling the strings.
Though many issues and corporate sponsors do blur the lines, there is a distinct difference between republicans and democrats. One of these two parties is openly advocating the elimination of government of, by, and for the people.
The result is a Plutocracy - rule by the wealthy, leading to a Fascist State.
Fuck we've been watching this happen since 2003 around here on this very discussion board. Most people have given up. It's difficult and sounds negative on facebook.
abbott
06-22-2012, 06:05 PM
Since2003
Is that rep. Dem. Or both.
yeahwho
06-22-2012, 07:30 PM
Since2003
Is that rep. Dem. Or both.
huh?
abbott
06-26-2012, 05:04 PM
all im sayin is if you put your faith in a party...
I say put your faith in a man.
Since 2003? Is that when bush was elected?
yeahwho
06-27-2012, 12:13 AM
The republicans are in love with Grover Norquist and his anti tax pledge that benefits the extremely wealthy.
In the 112th Congress serving from 2011–2, 238 members of the U.S. House of Representatives – a majority of that body – as well as 41 members of the U.S. Senate have signed the Taxpayer Protection Pledge. All except 13 sitting Republicans have signed the pledge, while three Democrats have signed it.
abbott
06-28-2012, 10:55 AM
I can't deny year 2003+ legislators fucked some shit up. I am not a registered Republican and saw shit being fucked up and knew it was being fucked up and will never deny shit got fucked up. The whole let anybody get a loan thing was a major factor. It was a total fuck job to the masses.
But I don't think the bailout was any better. I know people can build a case for it, but I think parts were another misuse of US tax dollars. I think the whole Rep. vs Dem. argument is a total waste of time. Anybody who voted for the bailout should not be reelected.
Senators and Congressman need to be replaced if they fuck up regardless of party. Its tough to replace your senator when there is so much seniority or if that senator is the party you need.
abbott
07-05-2012, 07:10 AM
if you like 1000 page bills to solve 5 page problems
if you like to use the words "it's complicated" to explain your tax system
if you like to think it cant be easy, we shouldn't be able to understand it
if you like special groups getting special treatment
Republicans and Democrats will both do just fine
yeahwho
07-05-2012, 11:37 AM
I understand your frustration to a certain degree and also realize much if not all legislation should arrive with salient points highlighted (much is already) and all alternate riders on these bills put forward rather than stated as an after fact.
Throughout the years contractors, banks and industry have made a business of bilking the government, environment and the customer with 0 recourse. Regulation is in place and language is in place to prevent the carnage.
So I'm, as you, concerned about the seemingly over complication of a simple tax, medical insurance or even something as obscure as fluorescent lighting ballast regulations that must be followed. I also understand that without some sort of reference explaining the details of a proposed bill, we would be clueless.
You, just as me have probably had to ask the question at work hundreds of times "So what does this mean and how are we suppose to do the job now?
I write up a memo and new procedures are put into place. As much as it seems like bullshit many times in the long run it's made my work environment safer. Less complicated? NO! I am buried in regulations but it's part of the industry I'm in.
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