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#1
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Re: Vaccine Nation
Forget it. There is no point to arguing science and logic with someone who is willfully apathetic and ignorant to both. Sadly such thickness means children's lives are put at risk, for no reason.
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#2
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Re: Vaccine Nation
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Personnal attack, well, i see the degree of your conscience...So much wisdom and maturity. Let me throw back at you your insults, if you please I feel the same way toward you, i think you are quite stupid and constipated. And then because people who cannot be critic of what the system impose us, and that have blind faith,kids health are at risk. Tata !!
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#3
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Re: Vaccine Nation
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I never used the word 'stupid'. I said "willfully apathetic and ignorant." There is a difference. If you're not stupid, you'll be able to see that. And if you are not willfully apathetic and ignorant, you'll maybe educate yourself a bit about how vaccines actually work, and what herd immunity is, and why it matters. |
#4
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Re: Vaccine Nation
FTG, This will be my last post on the topic it has gone on too long already. I am just trying to help you see the value of the scientific method as a tool for filtering data, I may well have failed at that but it was worth a shot. Just for clarification, I was not saying you are as bad as a drunk driver, my point was just that I am powerless to protect myself and my family from disease if others do not vaccinate (in case there was any misunderstanding).
I dont know why you find the concept of Herd Immunity hard to believe, it seems a straight forward concept as I do not know what the difficulty you have is, I will just post a link that may help you - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mathematical_modelling_in_epidemiology#The_mathema tics_of_mass_vaccination This study shows that infection in vaccinated children increases when the level of vaccination in the population drops - http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10404911 You say vaccines contain toxic and deadly substances and this is just does not seem to be true I presume you mean Thiomersal which is neither toxic nor in vaccines (at least in the US and Europe). If you name the substance you are concerned about I would be happy to help scan the scientific literature for more information. You raised the question as to which one of us is brainwashed. The reason I know it is you and not me is that my information is filtered by the scientific method and represents the scientific consensus. I have demonstrated to you that anti-pharma studies are not suppressed and can be easily found in the literature which should help dissuade you from this idea that there is an enormous conspiracy at play. The reason that it is you and not me that is buying into a conspiracy theory is that my view does not require a conspiracy. I am saying that thousands of independent scientists working in universities and labs around the world are doing good science, writing their theses and reporting their results while commenting on others as they always have done. You are saying that all these scientists are being paid, blackmailed or manipulated to change or hide their data whilst not reporting this enormous crime to the media or law enforcement. Do you see why it is your view that is the conspiracy and not mine? It is not just that you have a different view. I am aware of lobbying and that it is a tool for companies to move regulation in their favour I dont like it either. It does not mean, however, that regulation is ineffective or that the scientific method cannot be trusted or that the pharmaceutical industry is poisoning people. By all means voice your concerns regarding this practice, just dont go overboard and end up hurting yourself or your family. Wikipedia seems to have a lot of good data on these issues I would recommend it as a useful tool with a good overview. Here are some more links http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thiomersal_controversy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaccine_controversy
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#5
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Re: Vaccine Nation
Anyway, enough of blablabla and blahhhh.
I have my opinion, you have yours. Fine. The end. Oh and Misspeachy, your THICKNESS is lovely...
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#6
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Re: Vaccine Nation
Check it out, you want science, you have , oh but it is on youtube, must be a biased source of info,right?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5WNL...eature=related
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#7
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Re: Vaccine Nation
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What is misleading is for this to be presented as being relevant to the vaccine debate. The ingredient in Thimerisal is not Mercury (Hg) but Ethylmercury (C2H5Hg+). They have similar sounding names but are not at all the same thing – for example Chlorine (Cl) is a highly toxic substance however Sodium Choride (SaCl) is table salt. The video itself is not misleading but it has been given a title ‘Mercury in Vaccines Cause Brain Cell Damage’ which is very misleading as Thimerisal does not contain the substance used in the video. You will note that the narrator refers to Mercury in the context of tooth fillings not vaccines suggesting a legitimate video has been hijacked by an anti-vaccine nut. And has I have pointed out repeatedly, Thimerisal is not used in vaccines anymore. You do not need to take my word for this – this information is freely available to everyone. So as you can see, the youtube video has been mislabelled to mislead the viewer and I repeat the need to use caution on youtube. Let us be clear – (Pure and toxic) Mercury is not in Thimerisal. Thimerisal is not in western vaccines.
Last edited by HAL 9000 : 02-06-2009 at 06:10 AM. |
#8
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Re: Vaccine Nation
^ help me??? Please, help yourself...
You guys are stuck on doctor wakefield. This is just one case of bollocks. . HAl , i appreciate your devotion but, i prefer my source of info . It is not about a conspiracy, it is about some facts that are not always in the headlines news because it could harm the business of pharmaceutical companies. Some doctors are sell out some are not. A fact that some drugs and vaccins are not all that great in the end. You think medecine arrive at her apogee? No more mistakes can be made? Right... The two last link i posted are quite good with real information. But that not enough for you. Because of the title of the website. OK then, no need to discuss here anymore if you are not able to debate information i put here. http://www.therealessentials.com/vaccination-princ.html INstead you are somewhat telling me that i am not critic enough and wise enough to see true info from wrong and you say i take this personally, not at all. I don't give a shit really what you think of me and my ideas. To each their own. In my view , YOU are the one who is a bit sidetrack by just believing main stream media...
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#9
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Re: Vaccine Nation
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Look you just posted a link to a site that is selling smelly oil for medicinal purpose!!!! Are you seriously going to back Aromatherapy over evidence-based medicine!! Remember when I said this. Quote:
We are going in circles here all through this thread I have tried to keep away from the media, I have posted links to the RAW Data the pure facts, no opinion, no interpretation just real data. How can you possibly accuse me of this? I have shown that vaccines do not cause autism, that medical controls / regulation are effective and that it is the pseudoscientific community who is profiting off of the vulnerability of individuals by getting them to switch from clearly ineffective treatments from clearly effective ones. I have spelled it out for you as simply as I know how I can do no more but hope some of this has stuck.
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#10
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Re: Vaccine Nation
Your mistake in arguing with her is thinking that her position is actually based on reason and evidence, and not, as it in fact is, on some petulant, individualist-born notion of a "freedom" to believe whatever it is happens to strike her fancy.
I mean, it's almost fascistic of you to force her to believe that autism isn't caused by vaccines, what with your evidence and reason and logic! How hegemonic of you (and how hegemonic of the facts!) to not align with these preconceived notions of the world is. She chooses to believe that vaccines cause autism. That's all there is to it. She doesn't choose it FOR any reason, of course, simply because that's what she CHOOSES to believe. So your trying to convince her that she's wrong is really (from her perspective) an attempt to enslave her free-ranging, independent spirit. This is about as far as I've psychoanalyzed the anti-vaccine movement.
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#11
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Re: Vaccine Nation
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By the way, I'm watching PBS's documentary about polio again. It still scares me. |
#12
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Re: Vaccine Nation
shes french, give her a break
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