Official Lies: Barbara Olsens Flight 77 (pentagon) phonecall

[alien autopsy]

really like david ray griffin, id love to go see him speak.


very interesting to hear what he had to say about barbara olsen's flight 77 phonecall, and her husband, ted olsen former solicitor general of the department of justice (FBI).

Ted reported to CNN on 9-11 that his wife Barbara had cell phoned him which was then used to show that Flight 77 was then broadcasted while flight 77 was stil in the air, on its way to the pentagon. he then said it was one of those backseat phones that she used in the plane. then he changed his story again saying it was a cell phone. and then he changed it once more saying it was a back seat phone and leaving it at that.

A german researcher phoned american airlines and asked about their phone systems on their 757's (plane that reportedly hit the pentagon). he had read on the american airlines webpage that there were no phones on AA 757's. so he called a rep from AA. THERE WERE NO BACKSEAT PHONES ON THAT FLIGHT.

oops, Ted better revert back to his original statement that she used a cell phone.

In 2006, the FBI turned in a report at the moussaui trial on all the phone calls from all 4 flights. when they got to barbara olsen's phone call, it states that she made 1 attempted phone call, it did not get through and it lasted 0 seconds.

so Ted, how did your wife call you from Flight 77 if there were no backseat phones, and FBI phonerecords show that her cell phone call did not get through?


FBI is DOJ and says that their own former solicitor general is lying.

[Carlos]

yes it's just another of the pieces that totally contradict the official conspiracy theory.. there's no way that ANY phone calls could, or would have got through travelling at the altitude and speed that 77 was (according to FAA flight records)

Although we shouldn't jump to conclusions that Ted was 'in on it', as was shown loose change 2nd ed. the powers that be have voice replication technologies, and so could well have faked the call(s) to Ted. and Ted has just changed his story to fit in with what he thought was possible. But does smell somewhat.

That was in DRG's Debunking 911 debunking: a true masterpice - with logic, facts and simple science shows up the official story for the outlandish and completely un-substantiated-in-reality conspiracy theory that it is.
But once again most people would either be too lazy to read it, or reject it on an irrational a priori basis, and as such are ignorant of the most persuasive arguments against the official CT.

I'm sure there are very few, if any on this board willing to answer this... even though from the ferosity of some to challenge me/alien, and others that dared to quetion the official story, I would expect those to defend their beliefs:

What evidence have you personally seen/researched that would in any way corroborate the official conspiracy theory? ......you can site NIST, or the 911 comission, or any other sources, but I want specifics from those papers/sources.surely non of you can begrudge me wanting to know why you believe in the established conspiracy theory? :)

[YoungRemy]

What evidence have you personally seen/researched that would in any way corroborate the official conspiracy theory? ......you can site NIST, or the 911 comission, or any other sources, but I want specifics from those papers/sources.surely non of you can begrudge me wanting to know why you believe in the established conspiracy theory? :)


what evidence do we have that the above story is corroborated by official documents? is this story personally researched by our own investigative bbmb sleuth squad? where's a link that makes this cell phone smoking gun story valid?

more importantly, where is Barbara Olsen now? do you think she is on some remote island sipping a martini or is she six feet under?

[Laver1969]

what evidence do we have that the above story is corroborated by official documents? is this story personally researched by our own investigative bbmb sleuth squad? where's a link that makes this cell phone smoking gun story valid?

more importantly, where is Barbara Olsen now? do you think she is on some remote island sipping a martini or is she six feet under?

I really shouldn't be saying this...but I'll share it because it's that important.

Barbara Olsen actually called me. She was using another passenger's cellphone. I have my cellphone records to prove it. Plus I recorded conversation...I just can't figure out how to get the cassette recording onto youtube.

Remy I know where Barbara Olsen is now. I'm not a liberty to share specifically where, but I'll tell you it's very close to Gilligan's Island.

[alien autopsy]

why is the question of "where barbara olsen is now" more important? sounds like it would be something that would be asked on the cover of a speculation tabloid enquirer magazine. the really important information has nothing to do with speculation, but hardcore evidence presented in a court of law. and that is that she didnt make those calls. yet we were told she did. and the media so far is failing to pick upon that story and ask the appropriate questions like:

-did ted olsen actually recieve a phone call? if so, how could it have been his wife?

heres AA website (https://www.aa.com/content/travelInformation/duringFlight/onboardTechnology.jhtml)saying that the backseat phones and satelllite phones are only available on 777's and 767s. heres a 757 manual (http://truthorlies.org/AAManualPage.html)showing taht all of the phones were disconnected from the fleet of AA by january, 2001 (look at the date on the bottom, pg 1, not the rev. date at the top showing when this was printed.).

gotta run! will post information about the FBI report regarding the cell phone transmissions when i get back. its been written about enough that there should be a copy of it out there somewhere.
-

[yeahwho]

I really shouldn't be saying this...but I'll share it because it's that important.

Barbara Olsen actually called me. She was using another passenger's cellphone. I have my cellphone records to prove it. Plus I recorded conversation...I just can't figure out how to get the cassette recording onto youtube.

Remy I know where Barbara Olsen is now. I'm not a liberty to share specifically where, but I'll tell you it's very close to Gilligan's Island.

It is important where Barbara Olsen is now. This mystery has been looked into by the LATimes and really this whole phone call is a major part of the connecting inner matrix that opens the whole 9/11 conspiracy to light.

I am going to unravel a mind blowing tidbit of info here today, only because of the importance of the above discovery, Barbara Olsen was spotted at the party where Mary Anne was planted with Mary Jane (http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/celebrity/la-et-dawnwells11mar11,1,7138070.story).

This cover-up will now commence to unravel.

[alien autopsy]

its good that you can joke about it, but seriously...its kind of fucked up is it not?

[alien autopsy]

heres the link to the macromedia flash exhibit presented during the moussaoui trial in '06. its actually really well put together. its worth checking out. has all the information about all the flights, their passengers, the timelines, the calls, and the hijackers. this was the first time much this evidence was brought to court and made public.

i dont know how to cut and past from macromedia but you can check it from yourself, its directly from the government site (http://www.vaed.uscourts.gov/notablecases/moussaoui/exhibits/prosecution.html)which stores all exhibits from the trial, so its all very much legit.

but as you can see, there was 1 call attempt made by barbara olsen and it lasted 0 seconds. there were two calls from passenger renee may, which were to her parents. there were five "unknown numbers" which the macromedia presentation states "all cell phone calls are identified and all on-board phones indentified as 'unknown number'. interesting because we know there were no on-board phones on that plane because AA dismantled their phone systems (http://truthorlies.org/AAManualPage.html)on all their 757 fleet by january of 2001.

carlos brings up the question "what evidence do you have that supports the official story?" i think thats a fair question that deserves an answer if you are going to attempt to invalidate this evidence.

if you are too afraid to touch it then thats your own gig. fact of the matter is, evidence stands right in front of your face, and until it is disproven, it is fact. good luck chaps.

[alien autopsy]

p.s. on the government site (http://www.vaed.uscourts.gov/notablecases/moussaoui/exhibits/prosecution.html), it is exhibit P200054 (http://www.vaed.uscourts.gov/notablecases/moussaoui/exhibits/prosecution/flights/P200054.html). its a zip file.

[yeahwho]

It seems like a very thin thread, the Barbara Olsen phone call, if indeed her phone call never happened what does this mean? If her phone call did actually did happen what does that mean?

The evidence is inconclusive, or so it seems. The most amazing thing is the googled (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=barbara+olsen+phone+call&btnG=Search)information including the Pilots info is inconclusive to whether that plane actually had cell phones.

What are the implications your deriving from this.

[Carlos]

nice links Alien! they clearly show that this is the reality of events....

Yeahwho you say this is a weak thread, taken in isolation, yes it proves/shows nothing except that Ted Olsen was either mistaken/duped in who he was speaking to on 911, or that he lied.
But it does show how no-one could have called out from flight 77 because mobile phones did not work at the altitude, and speed the flight was going. And there were no seat back phones..
Therefore the whole 'emotive' accounts of flight 77 is a fabrication. In other words another segment/episode of the official 911 narrative cannot be trusted, or taken as what really happened.

But is a side point, not the nail in the coffin...


What is of far greater importance, is why so many people are willing to accept the official narrative, but very few are willing to back that belief up with anything substantial.
Once again...........

What evidence have you personally read/seen etc. that proves the official version to be true?

this should be the starting point of any discussion of 911, all we are doing is merely asking that the official 911 conspiracy theory needs to be shown to be true!!!! Is that really so idiotic, seeing as though it has shaped our way of thinking and perception of the world. Telling thing is no one seems to be willing to defend the official account in an open and public way - even pop mechs have now refused any kind of public debate (prob cos their pathetic attempts at debunking, have themselves been well and truly debunked)

We are the people leading the ratoinal and scientific debate, rather than hiding behind an unsubstantiated myth! Time and time again we will bring it back to the physical data and eveidence, even when asked constantly to speculate wildly as to the whereabouts of people and other such useless crap..

[alien autopsy]

It seems like a very thin thread, the Barbara Olsen phone call, if indeed her phone call never happened what does this mean? If her phone call did actually did happen what does that mean?

The evidence is inconclusive, or so it seems. The most amazing thing is the googled (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=barbara+olsen+phone+call&btnG=Search)information including the Pilots info is inconclusive to whether that plane actually had cell phones.

What are the implications your deriving from this.


i think its more than a thin thread, i think its another peice of evidence that should be investigated further. and i dont really know what else to derive from this, other than its another case where the 9-11 commission failed to go, or at the very least, wasnt given access to.

in your search, you'll notice no "credible" sources....you have to dig deeper and find the originals, like the ones i linked above. i take you directly to the source. thats the only way you can get an unbiased, unframed picture of events. its not worth reading into someones 9-11 rant if you are looking for truth. you have to have clear evidence without all the hype.

either way, its another peice of the 9-11 puzzle that needs to be understood in the larger timeline for that day.

[alien autopsy]

Associates of her husband said after she and the other passengers were herded into the back of the plane, she pulled out her cellphone and twice called her husband's office at the Justice Department. When she reached her husband, she told him the plane was being hijacked and urged him to quickly call the FBI.
CNN, the network for whom Mrs. Olson worked, reported that she also told her husband that the hijackers were wielding knives and cardboard cutters and that their motives were not readily apparent.
Since their marriage 5 years ago, the Olsons have been a formidable conservative pair. She wrote a biting biography of former first lady Hillary Rodham Clinton. He successfully represented George W. Bush at the Supreme Court last December, stopping the Florida recounts and guaranteeing Bush the White House.


source (http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2001/09/11/victims-olson.htm#more)

wow i didnt know that! mr olsen represented dubya to stop the recounts!

you'll notice that they mention the cell phone calls, and that she worked for cnn. i am pretty sure i remember watching cnn at the time of the hijacking and hearing breaking news of barbara's phone call while the plane was still hijacked and heading towards DC. im trying to find more info on that, because it that is the case, and this phone call was faked, or didnt happen at all, then its important to understand the significance of this call.

[abcdefz]

DRAAAAAAAAAAAINAGE

[alien autopsy]

lol.


cant find that barbara breaking news clip...maybe its a figment of my imagination. regardless....

[Carlos]

DRAAAAAAAAAAAINAGE

...sure it is for your obviously limited capacity for rational debate. I mean are you just here to show everyone what a spectacular moron you are? :rolleyes:

To treat the single most important event of the last 50 years with such contempt is truly a marvel of intellect. Congratulations!!
---

anyway back to the substance: a really good interview with Richard Gage on ABC national radio yesterday (http://www.alexjonesfan58.com/mp3/20080314_craft_gage.mp3): if only there was more people in the media willing to even entertain the subject - this is no conspiracy theorist: Richard solely deals with the science and empirical data: not once enters into any kind of conspiritorial speculation. He is at the forefront and embodies the main thrust of the 911 movement: to ask questions, and demand answers... not to speculate wildly as to who did what for what end..etc.

and as such we are less conspiracy theorists than the likes of abcdefz who obviously lapped up the conspiracy story hook line and sinker :p

[alien autopsy]

easy easy easy now. too much attacking, havent enough people been hurt by 911?:rolleyes:

[yeahwho]

I did read most of what was on google, I'm not trying to be obnoxious, but why don't you highlight credible sources with reference on your posts? The stuff I've read all has semi-quasi reliable anonymous folks with names like "panther piss" and such.

If your seriously trying to make a point, give the names of the AA employee or representative who stated flight 77 absolutely had no cell phones. Don't make us search.

Then give the name of who quantified cell phone usage at a set speed and altitude.

Your selling a whopper without any beef. Wheres the beef?

I ain't going to spend my time searching through links and hearsay threads. Post the facts about this goofy phone call that definitively states it could never happen.

PS I remember the Barbara Olsen clip. Just from the barrage of clips during the attack (or conspiracy to you)

[alien autopsy]

im a bit confused.

i gave the link to the actual physical exhibit of the moussaoui trial which proves that barbara did not place any such call- her attempted call failed to her husband ted.

i also gave the link from the AA flight manual proving that all backseat phones were dismantled before january of 2001 proving that ted's testimony that she placed an "on-board" phone call is mistaken, or false all together.

what else could you ask for? what more is there to prove?

[yeahwho]

This link, from the AA flight manual proving that all backseat phones were dismantled before january of 2001 (http://truthorlies.org/AAManualPage.html) tells me nothing and contradicts evidence from named individuals who say the phone systems were still operational on AA passenger planes, 757's included. If that link means something to the truthout people, then there is a bigger disconnect between me and them than ever before.

That link is vague, the goat book Bush was reading is much more informational and factual.

This link (http://www.vaed.uscourts.gov/notablecases/moussaoui/exhibits/prosecution.html) is a court document, why don't you sort it out for me, I'm not interested in all of it. Show me the part where a court of law says the phone call did not happen. Don't you think it is bullshit to throw something the majority of us have already figured out is bullshit into a huge complicated mess?

Just cut to the chase where a court of law says the phone call could never of happened.

[alien autopsy]

yeahwho, if you cant tie your own shoes, how are you going to walk?

as i mentioned above, you're going to have to take two minutes to open the macromedia flash zip file. it is the base-evidence, it is the FBI's presentation in the trial, showing all the information about the flights. its interactive, you might find it entertaining, i did:)

just open, click on the phonecalls section, click flight 77 and you are there. two minutes. i cant cut and past out of flash, so you have to do it yourself. i know that if i quote someone elses words, mainstream media or not, its going to go nowhere, so here is the basis, the factual basis.

ive done my part, now yours:

prove to me that there were phones on those american airline 757s on the date of september 11th.

[yeahwho]

yeahwho, if you cant tie your own shoes, how are you going to walk?

as i mentioned above, you're going to have to take two minutes to open the macromedia flash zip file. it is the base-evidence, it is the FBI's presentation in the trial, showing all the information about the flights. its interactive, you might find it entertaining, i did:)

just open, click on the phonecalls section, click flight 77 and you are there. two minutes. i cant cut and past out of flash, so you have to do it yourself. i know that if i quote someone elses words, mainstream media or not, its going to go nowhere, so here is the basis, the factual basis.

ive done my part, now yours:

prove to me that there were phones on those american airline 757s on the date of september 11th.

You cannot be concise, you have no case. It's always turning the debate into "Do Your Own Research". I have and I've found this conspiracy to be seriously flawed.
Facts are what count. Presented in a no bullshit concise matter. It isn't like I'm asking for you to make it more complicated. Wild goose chases are not credible to the average BBMB reader.

I'm not throwing anything up against the wall and trying to have you or any other reader try to figure it out. Why are you?

[alien autopsy]

why are you so hostile? its probably not good for your heart.

i gave you the facts i found which, to any reasonable person are pretty concise and clear. instead of looking at it, people are asking "oh yeah, well so where is barbara now?" and talking down on people gets you nowhere, which is a tendency alot have around here. all it does it take everything into a downward piss spiral. so why are you?

haha. figuring anything out has a lot to do with asking the right questions.


the manual is an internal document from american airlines. it is in the aircraft manual for the 757 fleet they operate. it says there are no phones on board. im sorry i dont have a photo of the backseat from the acutal flight 77 itself, but even if i did, i not to sure it would make sense to you.

[yeahwho]

why are you so hostile? its probably not good for your heart.

i gave you the facts i found which, to any reasonable person are pretty concise and clear. instead of looking at it, people are asking "oh yeah, well so where is barbara now?" and talking down on people gets you nowhere, which is a tendency alot have around here. all it does it take everything into a downward piss spiral. so why are you?

haha. figuring anything out has a lot to do with asking the right questions.


the manual is an internal document from american airlines. it is in the aircraft manual for the 757 fleet they operate. it says there are no phones on board. im sorry i dont have a photo of the backseat from the acutal flight 77 itself, but even if i did, i not to sure it would make sense to you.

Hostile? I'm not accusing anybody of a faked phone call, you are. That memo is vague. No representative of American Airlines is quoted. Did the US Government gag all of American Airlines employees? It is the largest passenger airline on the planet earth, only FedEx has more planes and that is by only the number of 15 more planes.

It is a memo alright, but what it references is nothing. Just that a 757 had no cell(s) phone(s) service on a particular piece of paper with no identification of who, where, when, why or how it happened. It is nothing.

Now if you would please post the other accusatory evidence you've accumulated, lets look at that and see where the fact is that states absolutely, beyond all reasonable doubt, in a court of law the phone call could not take place. Believe me I'm not half as hostile as those affected by the false information and time wasted on theories that had an innocent family member die on 9/11. This is why many here will force you to put up, in clear terms and fact what your trying to prove.

I ain't chasing wild geese, you are. So don't expect me to open my mind to speculation when thousands have died. If a conclusion is more concrete and factual I'll listen.

So once again for the sake of the remaining few who patronize these threads please,

Show me the part where a court of law says the phone call did not happen.

Then give the name of who quantified cell phone usage at a set speed and altitude.

[YoungRemy]

yeahwho(y)

[alien autopsy]

lol

[alien autopsy]

i guess i dont know what to say. hmm...i dont think im disrespecting anyone by asking these questions. at least its not at all my intentions. i dont buy into the whole, "thousands died and your an asshole for asking questions" bit. her phone call is an interesting issue and maybe it does deserve to be directly dealt with, in a court of law. the moussaoui trial was the first time that evidence was released to the public, and there is still a wealth of information that has not been released, such as the 80 or so videos that reportedly show proof of barbara's plane crashing into the pentagon. so far, i have seen no proof. but that is a whole seperate story.

i guess we can just leave it at that. you are unconvinced and i am not totally convinced but i think its interesting and worth noting. im happy to move on from here. i think this thread has run its course. unless anyone else has anything intelligent to add.

[alien autopsy]

Hostile?

Show me the part where a court of law says the phone call did not happen.

Then give the name of who quantified cell phone usage at a set speed and altitude.

yeah, dude, you're hostile.

i showed you the FBI exhibit flash file that proves her cell phone call didnt go through, that was presented in a court of law as evidence in the case against moussaoui. it would be purjury or something like that, for the FBI to present false evidence, so maybe you should get on that and get the FBI on purjury.

i dont know what you are talking about with the quantified cell phone usage at set speed and altitude.

[yeahwho]

yeah, dude, you're hostile.

i showed you the FBI exhibit flash file that proves her cell phone call didnt go through, that was presented in a court of law as evidence in the case against moussaoui. it would be purjury or something like that, for the FBI to present false evidence, so maybe you should get on that and get the FBI on purjury.

i dont know what you are talking about with the quantified cell phone usage at set speed and altitude.

I'm not hostile, I'm an reasonable citizen asking a very elementary question, your link is huge. I'm just saying why don't you cut to the chase and just post all the pertinent facts. I have a very distinct and exacting level of intensity when my chain gets yanked. I haven't asked you complicate anything, post the exact document that says no phone call went through.

Then out of the many thousands of AA employees find one who specifically states the cell phones did not function and in fact were removed from that plane, before 9/11/2001.

Without that information why continue? As far as the speed and altitude question, it's a point Carlos brought up,

But it does show how no-one could have called out from flight 77 because mobile phones did not work at the altitude, and speed the flight was going. And there were no seat back phones..
Therefore the whole 'emotive' accounts of flight 77 is a fabrication. In other words another segment/episode of the official 911 narrative cannot be trusted, or taken as what really happened.

The hostility your sensing is burden of proof. That day is more about human tragedy than conspiracy. I tend to believe Barbara Olsen died tragically and the surroundings of the phone call are a thin, extremely thin thread to grasp onto. It doesn't mean anything and I feel badly for her husband (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/main.jhtml?xml=/health/2002/03/05/folsen05.xml).

Olson was a passenger on American Airlines Flight 77 on her way to a taping of Politically Incorrect in Los Angeles (host Bill Maher left a panel seat vacant during the first week the show aired after the attacks), when it was flown into the Pentagon in the September 11, 2001 attacks. (She had been scheduled to take an earlier flight, but switched to that Flight 77 on that Tuesday, her husband's 61st birthday, in order to celebrate over dinner the night before.) She twice called her husband, then U.S. Solicitor General, from one of the phones in a passenger's seat, about 20 minutes before the plane hit the Pentagon, asking him "What can I do?"

[yeahwho]

The Court document you wanted me to open states that 8 phone calls were made, two from flight attendant Renee May (one call 0 seconds, the second 158 seconds.) one from Barbara Olsen and 5 unidentified calls.

The one call from Barbara Olsen is 20 minutes before impact, it is recorded at 0 seconds. (As her husband stated)

Then there are 5 unidentified phone calls from Flight 77 that morning, between 9:14 and 9:30 AM. (one did not go through, the others are all over a minute... 4 of them connected one lasted 260 seconds, right up to impact.

That is what I just read from the court document you would not supply us with.

[alien autopsy]

yeahwho i posted 3 or 4 links to that document in this thread. you even stated this:

This link (http://www.vaed.uscourts.gov/notablecases/moussaoui/exhibits/prosecution.html) is a court document, why don't you sort it out for me, I'm not interested in all of it. Show me the part where a court of law says the phone call did not happen. Don't you think it is bullshit to throw something the majority of us have already figured out is bullshit into a huge complicated mess?


and i directly linked you to a copy of the manual for the boeing 757 AA flet which states there are no on-board phones on that aircraft.

Chad Kinder
Customer Relations
American Airlines

thats the name of the american airlines representative spoken to. you could contact him if you want. here's two more individuals who also spoke with american airlines reps.


In 2004, Ian Henshall and Rowland Morgan, having asked American Airlines whether their “757s [are] fitted with phones that passengers can use,” received this reply from an AA spokesperson: “American Airlines 757s do not have onboard phones for passenger use.”

source (http://pilotsfor911truth.org/amrarticle.html)

since i have provided you with evidence that there are no phones on board, then you prove to me that there are. i have shown you 2 seperate sources claiming they have spoken with AA reps and received a reply stating there were no onboard phones, in addition:

heres the AA website (https://www.aa.com/aa/i18nForward.do?p=/travelInformation/duringFlight/onboardTechnology.jsp)talking about "on-board technology" specifically, on board phones:

Turn flight time into quality time by arranging meetings, calling your broker or calling home. Worldwide satellite communications are available on American Airlines' Boeing 777 and Boeing 767 aircraft almost anytime while flying over North America and worldwide

notice, the only planes that have onboard phones in AA's fleet are 777's and 767's.

and the flight maintenance manual...here posted on pilots for truth website, a group consisting of hundreds of PILOTS (http://pilotsfor911truth.org/core.html). dont you think they would be able to recognize if this document was fraud?

i have already linked it to you several times, but here it is again.

the flight maintenance manual stating all on-board phones were disabled by january 2001. (http://pilotsfor911truth.org/AA757AMM.html)




SO, LETS REVIEW:
we have-
1. a flight manual verified by pilots for truth, stating that as of january 2001, there were no on-board phones on flight 77.
2. 2 seperate correspondences with american airlines representatives indicating that there are no on-board phones on the 757 fleet.
3. an AA webpage showing the inflight features, mentioning that only 767's and 777's have on-board phones.
4. an FBI document that states barbara couldnt have called from her cell phone.


you have no evidence supporting your claim that there were on board phones, you are only arguing my claims with no substance behind it, repeatedly claiming its a thin-thread of evidence. show me the reason why you believe they did have phones that worked on the flight. lets compare our evidence yeahwho, and not digress into "the suffering families, what nerve you have to ask these questions" routine.

[yeahwho]

yeahwho i posted 3 or 4 links to that document in this thread. you even stated this:



and i directly linked you to a copy of the manual for the boeing 757 AA flet which states there are no on-board phones on that aircraft.

Chad Kinder
Customer Relations
American Airlines

thats the name of the american airlines representative spoken to. you could contact him if you want. here's two more individuals who also spoke with american airlines reps.


source (http://pilotsfor911truth.org/amrarticle.html)

since i have provided you with evidence that there are no phones on board, then you prove to me that there are. i have shown you 2 seperate sources claiming they have spoken with AA reps and received a reply stating there were no onboard phones, in addition:

heres the AA website (https://www.aa.com/aa/i18nForward.do?p=/travelInformation/duringFlight/onboardTechnology.jsp)talking about "on-board technology" specifically, on board phones:



notice, the only planes that have onboard phones in AA's fleet are 777's and 767's.

and the flight maintenance manual...here posted on pilots for truth website, a group consisting of hundreds of PILOTS (http://pilotsfor911truth.org/core.html). dont you think they would be able to recognize if this document was fraud?

i have already linked it to you several times, but here it is again.

the flight maintenance manual stating all on-board phones were disabled by january 2001. (http://pilotsfor911truth.org/AA757AMM.html)




SO, LETS REVIEW:
we have-
1. a flight manual verified by pilots for truth, stating that as of january 2001, there were no on-board phones on flight 77.
2. 2 seperate correspondences with american airlines representatives indicating that there are no on-board phones on the 757 fleet.
3. an AA webpage showing the inflight features, mentioning that only 767's and 777's have on-board phones.
4. an FBI document that states barbara couldnt have called from her cell phone.


you have no evidence supporting your claim that there were on board phones, you are only arguing my claims with no substance behind it, repeatedly claiming its a thin-thread of evidence. show me the reason why you believe they did have phones that worked on the flight. lets compare our evidence yeahwho, and not digress into "the suffering families, what nerve you have to ask these questions" routine.

Show me the part where a court of law says the phone call did not happen.

Then give the name of who quantified cell phone usage at a set speed and altitude.

The Court document you wanted me to open states that 8 phone calls were made, two from flight attendant Renee May (one call 0 seconds, the second 158 seconds.) one from Barbara Olsen and 5 unidentified calls.

Your now saying this to me "you have no evidence supporting your claim that there were on board phones". I never claimed any such bullshit. Your the one who says there were no phones and I'm still waiting for the proof. What really is happening here is NOTHING!

The one call from Barbara Olsen is 20 minutes before impact, it is recorded at 0 seconds. (As her husband stated)

Then there are 5 unidentified phone calls from Flight 77 that morning, between 9:14 and 9:30 AM. (one did not go through, the others are all over a minute... 4 of them connected one lasted 260 seconds, right up to impact.

That link going to hundreds of pilots (http://pilotsfor911truth.org/core.html) is a crack up, are you losing it? I counted 69 individuals, some are not pilots, some use one name and one of the poor fellows was forced to retire due to his 9/11 exposure. The goofiest thing is none of them have ever worked for American Airlines.

Lets compare our evidence yeahwho, and not digress into "the suffering families, what nerve you have to ask these questions" routine.

This Barbara Olsen thing, the one where you say I'm playing some sort of sympathy card, I am taking into consideration that an ever growing amount of asshats will continually doubt circumstances around the deaths of people they do not know. The bigger picture that your missing is brilliant people have morals, ethics and very analytical minds.

I have come here as a way to enlighten whatever I can and to debate in a civil manner, it is obvious that not only do you and I differ completely on 9/11, your ignoring the facts that the court document says eight "8" phone calls were made that day. All of them correlate to the time line Ted Olsen says he received his call(s). What is so fucked up about that?

[yeahwho]

yeahwho i posted 3 or 4 links to that document in this thread. you even stated this:



and i directly linked you to a copy of the manual for the boeing 757 AA flet which states there are no on-board phones on that aircraft.

Chad Kinder
Customer Relations
American Airlines

thats the name of the american airlines representative spoken to. you could contact him if you want. here's two more individuals who also spoke with american airlines reps.

I could contact him if I want? Here on earth I'm just going through your link and once again it's another bunch of pure unadultered crap.

Lets out this link (http://pilotsfor911truth.org/amrarticle.html) up for all to see, I'll highlight a few pathetic parts for ease of digestion;

The Chad Kinder Email: One piece of evidence was brought to our attention by a member of the Pilots for 9/11 Truth forums who goes by the alias “Kesha.” Using one of these forums, “Kesha” reported that the following email exchange had been posted February 17, 2006, on a German political forum. A person using the alias “the Paradroid” had sent this email to American Airlines:


Hello, on your website . . . there is mentioned that there are no seatback satellite phones on a Boeing 757. Is that info correct? Were there any such seatback satellite phones on any Boeing 757 before or on September 11, 2001 and if so, when were these phones ripped out?


This was the reply received by “the Paradroid” (except that his real name has been crossed out):


Dear Mr. XXXXXXXX:


Thank you for contacting Customer Relations. I am pleased to have the opportunity to assist you.


That is correct we do not have phones on our Boeing 757. The passengers on flight 77 used their own personal cellular phones to make out calls during the terrorist attack. However, the pilots are able to stay in constant contact with the Air Traffic Control tower.


Mr. XXXXXXXX, I hope this information is helpful. It is a privilege to serve you.


Sincerely,
Chad W. Kinder
Customer Relations
American Airlines

[yeahwho]

I'm not a last word freak, you can debunk me all you want to after this on the "Spooky Barbara Olsen Phone Call Evidence".

This is lifted from a post I made in 2006 from this thread (http://www.beastieboys.com/bbs/showthread.php?t=70897&highlight=9%2F11)

The exploitation of 9/11 is more worrisome than the actual event. It's like a widow of 9/11 victims said on the radio one morning as I was driving home from nightwatch,

Imagine your family was killed in an auto accident 5 years ago and they just keep throwing it in your face over and over no matter where you go or what you do, never escaping the actual event or healing the wounds.

Fear is what motivates our current status as Americans. Sad.

[alien autopsy]

i share your skepticism of this paradroid fellow. however, i think its not enough to base a judgement on, you have to look at the other supporting evidence as well.

[Carlos]

I think yeahwho is getting himself in a twist...

Quite clearly without ANY doubt there are no seatback phones in the airplane in question, and at the time in question. And all evidence shows that NO call was made to ted Olsen where he spoke with his wife!! Surely you are not trying to argue black is white yeahwho - as this is from the FBI's own presentation, and factual empirical data regarding the seat -back phones.
Here are the full details with sources: http://pilotsfor911truth.org/amrarticle.html - although Alien has provided all the data very clearly already.

Here’s where I think the confusion lies: The trial does suggest that some mobile/cell phones got through, and I did say that this also would be almost impossible due to the altitude and speed of the flight path. 25,000 feet, and 300+ mph - i'll read the part of DRG's book which goes into this, to give you sources for this.. yes that’s right not all information is easily accessible in link form, you actually have to read books!!

So to conclude, we know the story about Barabara is a complete hoax: either Ted was lying, or he was duped. Not really a 'major' part of the jigsaw, just another part that contradicts reality.
If you want to dispute the part regarding any cell phones being able to get through then fair enough: but please provide some evidence that proves it was possible!! Otherwise you are asking for something, that you are again unwilling to provide yourself; i.e evidence and facts to back up your adopted position.

The exploitation of 9/11 is more worrisome than the actual event. Yeahwho did you watch any of these vids I posted here.... " So (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kRnwRxXJw6M) are (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TXp2eHGnbI) ALLthese (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtDYuQw3P98) people (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LcLzBCTkvbg) full (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbwdLZo-eew)of (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEunHLLoj2w)bullshit (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GaFM1eR6fF8) too?" surely asking the same questions and wanting answers for their dead relatives is not exploiting shit?
Blowing apart a myth which has been used to exploit it for oil, money and power, is the very fucking purpose of all this!! Why not use your (slightly poor) investigative skills to bring proof for the official story to light: as yet there is none... as again you fail to say what evidence you have seen/read for believing so fervently in it.
Or more to the point, use them to ask if it was possible, cos that's our starting point: is this conspiracy theory plausible?

[yeahwho]

Here’s where I think the confusion lies: The trial does suggest that some mobile/cell phones got through, and I did say that this also would be almost impossible due to the altitude and speed of the flight path. 25,000 feet, and 300+ mph - i'll read the part of DRG's book which goes into this, to give you sources for this.. yes that’s right not all information is easily accessible in link form, you actually have to read books!!

The Court document states that 8 phone calls were made, two from flight attendant Renee May (one call 0 seconds, the second 158 seconds.) one from Barbara Olsen and 5 unidentified calls.

The one call from Barbara Olsen is 20 minutes before impact, it is recorded at 0 seconds. (As her husband stated)

Then there are 5 unidentified phone calls from Flight 77 that morning, between 9:14 and 9:30 AM. (one did not go through, the others are all over a minute... 4 of them connected one lasted 260 seconds, right up to impact. The unidentified calls are unidentified because the number calling out was never identified.

That is what I just read from the court document.

Carlos, for the life of me I think you must be a practical joker, is this some sort of joke? I feel as if I'm being duped into an idiots point of view on 9/11. Are you part of the MIHOP or LIHOP group of blithering paranoids?

Your sources, they don't do their homework, it's a kind of charlatanism. I'm only entertaining you because I find all of this thread and every 9/11 conspiracy thread on this board to complete nonsense.

If you can state your side of the story, then I'll just read the facts, accumulated knowledge, sort through the court cases and respond. Which is with facts none of you will ever be able to disprove. Because you know what? The delusion of illusion is turning you into a straw grasper, with nothing left to cling onto but thin air. This thread is weak..... really desperate, like a call for help thread. You must know this is total nonsense.

Are you guys just fucking with me? The next jerk off session should be really interesting.

[alien autopsy]

you have to understand yeahwho, there is enough evidence to investigate this further...not just this phonecall, but many other events that took place on or around 9-11. what we need is a new investigation to pick through all the evidence that was either left aside, ignored, or has recently surfaced since the 9-11 commission.

i think it deserves to be looked into with more resources, and by professional investigators. maybe you are right, that barbara was one of the unidentified callers. doesnt explain ted's story. doesnt explain the official story released to the press in the days after.


im curious on how a caller can even be unidentified...what does that mean? does it mean they didnt identify themselves on the phone? does it mean we dont know who called on what phone? cant we look at individual phone records for those on board to see who made which call? if the call was good enough to go through, there has to be some record of it. especially if it was a clear and concise phonecall such as that relayed by ted olsen. we need to be asking these questions because there is evidence that doesnt fit perfectly with the story.


i feel the need to ask questions because im skeptical of the official story in light of the piles of evidence from all angles which contradicts that which we were told. those who dont feel the need have their reasons. you obviously think all people who question 9-11 are kooks who are dishonoring the fallen heroes and wasting their time and the suffering of 9-11 family members. we all have our reasons and motivations. and they all have their place.

[yeahwho]

you have to understand yeahwho, there is enough evidence to investigate this further...not just this phonecall, but many other events that took place on or around 9-11. what we need is a new investigation to pick through all the evidence that was either left aside, ignored, or has recently surfaced since the 9-11 commission.

i think it deserves to be looked into with more resources, and by professional investigators. maybe you are right, that barbara was one of the unidentified callers. doesnt explain ted's story. doesnt explain the official story released to the press in the days after.


im curious on how a caller can even be unidentified...what does that mean? does it mean they didnt identify themselves on the phone? does it mean we dont know who called on what phone? cant we look at individual phone records for those on board to see who made which call? if the call was good enough to go through, there has to be some record of it. especially if it was a clear and concise phonecall such as that relayed by ted olsen. we need to be asking these questions because there is evidence that doesnt fit perfectly with the story.


i feel the need to ask questions because im skeptical of the official story in light of the piles of evidence from all angles which contradicts that which we were told. those who dont feel the need have their reasons. you obviously think all people who question 9-11 are kooks who are dishonoring the fallen heroes and wasting their time and the suffering of 9-11 family members. we all have our reasons and motivations. and they all have their place.

You asked me to read the evidence you provided, I did. it supplied the phone calls from all three flights on 9/11 involved with the attack.

It's your evidence, the court of law evidence supplied by both of you.

The Barbara Olsen phone call sounds as if it actually did happen. The scope of the investigation into 9/11 is huge. You people have to be out of your minds if the Barbara Olsen call is your reasoning for even posting here.

Find something else to rant about, some other area of 9/11 that proves the government was behind the day.

Barbara Olsen is not doing anything but making you look silly, and she is dead. She died on Flight 77 when it went into the Pentagon. durrrrrrrrrrr

[Documad]

The nerve of her husband! His wife called him shortly before she died in a hijacking
and he didn't spend their last conversation questioning her about exactly what sort of
phone she was using!

[Carlos]

The Barbara Olsen phone call sounds as if it actually did happen.

please tell us what you are basing that rather vague conclusion/assumption on? As all the evidence shows otherwise (a 0 sec call = no call). and no seat back phones, these are undeniable facts!!! If you are basing it on the unidentified calls, then you are basing it on an assumption.


You people have to be out of your minds if the Barbara Olsen call is your reasoning for even posting here.

from the numerous othre 911 threads on this baord you have commented on you know this is not true, so why bother say it?



....She died on Flight 77 when it went into the Pentagon. durrrrrrrrrrr

Again please supply the empirical data which supports this claim: as yet we have not had any video footage conclusively proving what hit the pentagon.

Time and time again yeahwho, you are willing to adopt information without actually establishing if it's real.
Unless of course it suggest the official story to be untrue, in which case you'll go to any length to debunk that information (even as far as willfully denying established facts). Maybe a little more even handedness as regards to information is needed???!!!

You've been rather childish in this thread, as to any objective, fully-sighted person no information shows that Ted spoke to Barbara. Once again, if you can supply any data which does show this I'm all ears.

But to be honset this thread has run it's course: we've clearly shown there is nothing that supports Ted's claim other than his own (changing)testimony.

I think we really need to get back to basics on this board regarding the whole subject - I'll start another thread asap.

[alien autopsy]

yeahwho, i really do appreciate you actually reading the evidence and commenting on it. i think there is a tendency for most people to overlook the evidence and jump to conclusions.

Time and time again yeahwho, you are willing to adopt information without actually establishing if it's real.
Unless of course it suggest the official story to be untrue, in which case you'll go to any length to debunk that information (even as far as willfully denying established facts).

the 9-11 commission "worked" for this very reason. people just accept the official version and then go crazy when you try to suggest to them anything on the contrary. you are definately right carlos- most people who accept the official story, have little to no evidence supporting their claims. they just believe in it because it is official, it was chartered, and delivered.

i agree. this thread has run its course. it started with some evidence, and then some analysis of that evidence, and now a conclusion:

im curious on how a caller can even be unidentified...what does that mean? does it mean they didnt identify themselves on the phone? does it mean we dont know who called on what phone? cant we look at individual phone records for those on board to see who made which call? if the call was good enough to go through, there has to be some record of it. especially if it was a clear and concise phonecall such as that relayed by ted olsen. we need to be asking these questions because there is evidence that doesnt fit perfectly with the story.

its still up in the air and deserves further investigation.

[Carlos]

indeed.. props for actually looking at the evidence! (y)

[yeahwho]

I think we really need to get back to basics on this board regarding the whole subject - I'll start another thread asap.

Good luck with that, you'll also see the end of any intelligent conversation on your thread, you see most of the folks who post here have already accepted the incompetent/opportunistic theory.

I rarely post in 9/11 threads and I see now why so many bright, witty and intelligent people have quit posting after being engaged with a mind like yours. Arrogance and ignorance.

Go cast a shadow of doubt on some other board. I will join you with a barrage of puppies when your new thread begins, because you need some happiness in your dark conspiracy life.

This was aready dumbest thread to ever appear on the BBMB and then to my amazement you made it even dumber with this statement,

Again please supply the empirical data which supports this claim: as yet we have not had any video footage conclusively proving what hit the pentagon.
You must be very proud of yourself.

[Carlos]

seriously how old are u? you're acting like a spoilt child..

lets get back to facts, and data.. not mudslinging and you going blah blah blah.. you don't know shit about me, or what i do... and i could quite easily say your belief in a load of muslims carrying out an attack on the USA is a dark conspiracy, that has clouded not only your understanding of the world, but may thousands more..
u see you just don't get things objectively - everything you say is skewed due to your un-wavering belief in what you have been told.


you see most of the folks who post here have already accepted the incompetent/opportunistic theory.
that's cool, but please be prepared to explain what that means and defend it with empirical data and facts, as yet even after NUMEROUS times of asking you are completely unwilling to do so - or too lazy..... but ironically you have no probs asking us to do so!!!

[yeahwho]

seriously how old are u? you're acting like a spoilt child..

lets get back to facts, and data.. blah, blah, glibby, blah

I aIn'ttt spoilt, u want to see spoilt, lerk at thiz (http://a.abcnews.com/images/US/ht_puppy_070620_ms.jpg)

[Carlos]

:)

just as footnote to this thread, as promised here is the data regarding connectivity of cell phones at high altitutde:

http://www.physics911.net/projectachilles

now you could reject it as not being sound, however the scientist is a renowned science writer: A.K Dewdney, who writes for Scientific America. Therefore would not be doubted on his scientific credentials, unless it's a subject like this... also check the comments, some by other scientitists.

[YoungRemy]

correct me if I'm wrong, but the airplanes hijacked on 9/11 were flying much lower than 25,000 feet, no? I'm talking about moments before impact.

cel phones work upon initial descent when they are below the clouds...

how do we know she didn't use someone else's phone? I'm trying here...

[alien autopsy]

try and make and cell phone call on a commercial airline- i try it all the time, just to test when i am flying...i never have gotten a signal unless i am within 5 minutes of landing/takeoff.

[YoungRemy]

within 5 minutes of landing being the operative phrase...

[alien autopsy]

correct me if I'm wrong, but the airplanes hijacked on 9/11 were flying much lower than 25,000 feet, no? I'm talking about moments before impact.

cel phones work upon initial descent when they are below the clouds...

how do we know she didn't use someone else's phone? I'm trying here...

true, but flight 77 was flying very fast, much faster than an airplane trying to land. part of the issue, it appears, is speed, not only altitude.

barbara's call was made at 9:18 am. you can watch this movie, pandoras black box (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8672066571196607580) which was an analysis of flight 77's black box released through a freedom of information act. at 9:00 am the flight was still at 35,000 ft, hadnt began its decent. by 9:08, it was at 22000 ft beginning decent. at 9:30 the plane was at about 9000 ft. (the movie doesnt at all focus on the call, im just using the NTSB black box info to find altitude-only on major discrepencies in the NTSB analysis of flight 77)

9:08- 22,000 ft
9:30- 9,000 ft

in 22 minutes plane decended 13,000 ft

13000ft/22 min= 590 ft/min descent

at 9:08 plane at 22000 ft.

10 mninutes to 9:18 when barbara called. 10minutesx590ft/min= 5,900ft

22000-5900=16100 ft when barbara made her call.


the 4 unknown calls were made from 9:15-9:30....the last call ( and at the lowest elevation) was at 9:30 when the plane was still 9,000 ft above sea level.

[alien autopsy]

within 5 minutes of landing being the operative phrase...


7 minutes before landing flight 77 was still 9000 ft above sea level according to the official NTSB black box info. that is when the last call was made...9,000 ft above sea level is pretty high up there. the research carlos cited shows multiple types of cellphones, in a much slower moving plane, at 8,000 ft having a 13% success rate. you also have to adjust for airspeed- which commercial airliners are much faster than cessnas. so you figure there is below a 13% chance that a call can be completed. so it is possible, but not probable that her call got through on an unknown number.

my question remains, how can it be an "unknown number". we know who was on the plane, we know when they called. surely those people had phone bills. why cant we match up their phone records to the calls and find out whos phone connected to that DOJ (ted's) number. obviously that would take an investigation on the FBI's part.

one more reason to demand a real investigation into the events surrounding 9-11.

[Carlos]

(y)

[yeahwho]

(y)Great Detective Work! (http://z.about.com/d/deafness/1/0/C/2/IHDI_2.jpg)(y)

[Elusive]

don't you guys remember it was the
beastie boys that masterminded 9/11???
Look at the cover for license to lll now look at the cover for 2 the 5 boros.

see see see?
someone had made a picture a while back on this site remember?